Received: from mail-wg0-f55.google.com ([74.125.82.55]:34718) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Um3ze-0004mi-MJ for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 08:27:03 -0700 Received: by mail-wg0-f55.google.com with SMTP id f12sf1156343wgh.20 for ; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 08:26:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=64+o5M01o7VoIYIcjuvhzgnfPdd/ydaWN9Mpw1yKKJE=; b=m+AzYzxp6tJMqIT8opZuDW7MONuVSCgFVkL+rdpi4y6hFLpOLxmWBZFrvtRSNtDr+F eXd5OkQjywjwfIwy0CUZmVzxOet9jUGmdK/N4qYR066yI35C4SJLvNB526zsDnKx6/3m 2d0jBeGsE8R5Q/3Xz+C/YKZBINByiAIe/6ChQ5nVY61+4NfSqHizWyjPfmeeTe6I6ClI DzcltoTviEamv41ov6EfFbecytuRBlMpmRDPQobPXLrfbPtNvkbb3FJnujUPbvwR/wpN VoKwZ89ZdHCKNVMsB5aB0MYj0KmxVk2tjpjJmpOeLyvB5vtIvLmKP3x1PsGuC+k/i6QF N8yw== X-Received: by 10.180.90.34 with SMTP id bt2mr518304wib.7.1370878003040; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 08:26:43 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.180.101.70 with SMTP id fe6ls864095wib.11.gmail; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 08:26:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.15.44.65 with SMTP id y41mr15734333eev.5.1370878001775; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 08:26:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dd17822.kasserver.com (dd17822.kasserver.com. [85.13.138.119]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id n49si1676447eeu.0.2013.06.10.08.26.41 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 10 Jun 2013 08:26:41 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 85.13.138.119 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of me@v4hn.de) client-ip=85.13.138.119; Received: from samsa (brln-4dba9e21.pool.mediaWays.net [77.186.158.33]) by dd17822.kasserver.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id E160386160D for ; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:26:40 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:26:40 +0200 From: v4hn To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla Message-ID: <20130610152640.GH24964@samsa.fritz.box> References: <51A6685C.3010505@lojban.org> <1572136.Rc9a1FkyGG@caracal> <51B5AACD.8040106@gmx.de> <4765457.N8ok8LCe9x@caracal> <1370876772.5658.YahooMailNeo@web184403.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="fd5uyaI9j6xoeUBo" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1370876772.5658.YahooMailNeo@web184403.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Original-Sender: me@v4hn.de X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 85.13.138.119 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of me@v4hn.de) smtp.mail=me@v4hn.de Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --fd5uyaI9j6xoeUBo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 08:06:12AM -0700, John E Clifford wrote: > And,of course, others of us think that what needs discussing is grammar, to get it right. > Vocabulary arises as it is needed but we are way ahead of any uses in that area. > How we put that stuff together, however, is what makes for a logical language, > and there there are apparent gaps and inconsistencies. There is no "right". What's the huge inconsistency of cmevla not being brivla? I followed the thread but apparently this is neither about "gaps" nor inconsistency. It's about changing things that work and worked fine for quite some time just because people call unnecessary "simplifications" progress - Lojban ba'e already is the most simple language (with a real user group) I know - instead of focussing on making the language more usable in everyday life (which I would call progress). Additionally, such discussions only split the community even further until everyone got "his/her personal xorlo". It's just that probably none of them would then ever be implemented for everyone. v4hn --fd5uyaI9j6xoeUBo Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlG18DAACgkQMBKLZs4+wjz0xgCfTtxYC8lXmQNmmHaLCnEQXd0Y hsIAoK9GVmiyH2eevgWWRISVgwGq7TZn =wRkG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --fd5uyaI9j6xoeUBo--