Received: from mail-we0-f188.google.com ([74.125.82.188]:33367) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1UmEsc-0002W9-1s for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:33 -0700 Received: by mail-we0-f188.google.com with SMTP id o12sf97493wes.15 for ; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=iNRLnL7ZTwboUrBQ1Du8Pdxgtx/47XcneAvTIYwRlNI=; b=FrjlI9foICKJA5OnsvWf3YxjMyDr2ODyhUkv14+1gwXtDD5qJwDodeyB042QOjS4VC wjYOG5ij/ZaqnTKYrPzaxqbPkanag7oqvMVGirmRJoBoreFCq72udv+Nbn5ZqQkQn2YP iJCC5sD4hXiX7ZjbMQCFzfRuXVdDLGTwmvx6YgdDEWHqYNm5i/hmUO3nr9ocjwdem3IE V021hNJ4ggG4Ivdy/L0NXSfaUPYjBFtMttIEL88iM49xw+K2av6RbvwoaARdwv5gbnHY 7MFIgZ7Aqj9plJ6C4SckmdleaZlgud7G4wpY5fBUZ2xjsOMnuo+rhgl34Dq2+i9+MSeI phLw== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-beenthere:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=iNRLnL7ZTwboUrBQ1Du8Pdxgtx/47XcneAvTIYwRlNI=; b=FsZ+ZXUc+ZiYNWZCL1p5jBIf4MUBJWghqDQfXlvxvpymoP2aN03LdlDo22/voaxWIx e2HQQ0W/rMQMdXYxTphpwu3E7jBzdbFdpNs0CBGB730Rqs9R21T0bSILv1y45NnIyS6k 02DneiU3R3oMtGkbKJBg+0zBOXAZ+qSiifdMV1yPWgOH12r8x/5p7xidDJHqZJXl43Dw LyeOQxm3FBnCXk0PkgygPJM6f8v1OUxJt8tW2ALTGC6w4/fSkZvcIpHPNGdcy882+xSg znzkIOwvUeq5eCTjGbHYSTCHPliADcUAIoGkwk98y+nFTDUaI9u1WbV94HLohF6SBIE4 /gfg== X-Received: by 10.180.189.106 with SMTP id gh10mr793237wic.10.1370919850396; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:10 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.180.183.229 with SMTP id ep5ls1015261wic.20.canary; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.205.32.144 with SMTP id sk16mr691345bkb.4.1370919849822; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lb0-f170.google.com (mail-lb0-f170.google.com [209.85.217.170]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id cm16si855016bkb.0.2013.06.10.20.04.09 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:09 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.217.170 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.217.170; Received: by mail-lb0-f170.google.com with SMTP id t13so2071712lbd.15 for ; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:04:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.112.140.231 with SMTP id rj7mr7924307lbb.16.1370919366376; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 19:56:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.114.21.38 with HTTP; Mon, 10 Jun 2013 19:56:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1370918025.57449.YahooMailNeo@web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <51A379EF.3020803@gmx.de> <51A6685C.3010505@lojban.org> <51A8680E.7040103@lojban.org> <51A8F326.2020901@lojban.org> <51A8F89D.2040408@gmx.de> <51B00097.8080004@lojban.org> <51B06D24.6020102@gmx.de> <51B46762.8080509@lojban.org> <1370781558.18791.YahooMailNeo@web184404.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <51B4BA33.1030507@lojban.org> <51B4EEFA.9060009@lojban.org> <51B6633B.6080502@lojban.org> <1370918025.57449.YahooMailNeo@web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2013 20:56:06 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.217.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c26a30d942e604ded80956 X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --001a11c26a30d942e604ded80956 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yeah, I'm pretty sure CMENE is a klesi, and not a selma'o. On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 8:33 PM, John E Clifford wrot= e: > Well, CLL does not list a selma'o CMENE in the list of all the selma'o. I= t > does use selma'o style reference ("CMENE") in two rules, one of them mere= ly > the phonological definition of what are now called cmevla, the other > defining the multi-cmevla cmene, which are called cmene and are clearly > not in CMENE. None of the other things that are names, e.g., {la tsani} > are called cmene either and even regular cmevla and cmevla strings are > called names throughout most of the text (other than the section on the > phonological definition). So, nobody is really sticking to CLL too > closely. A nomenclature conference might come in handy. Personally, I > like "names". > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Robert LeChevalier > *To:* lojban@googlegroups.com > *Sent:* Monday, June 10, 2013 6:37 PM > > *Subject:* Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla > > Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > > I'll wait for you to read the context then. > > > > > > (I still don't know what a "cmevla" is. I know what a "cmene" i= s) > > > > > > A cmevla is any Lojban word that ends in a consonant. > > > > Examples of (single) cmene that are not (single) cmevla are: "la'o gy > > Starbucks gy", "la djan smit", "la selpa'i" > > > > It is useful to be able to distinguish the special word form "cmevla" > > from the more general notion of cmene. These two concepts used to be > > confused when cmevla were called cmene, since not all cmene have the > > form of cmevla. > > CMENE is the name of the selma'o that consists of those things you are > calling cmevla. > > So not all cmene have the morphology of CMENE (since not all cmene are > Lojban at all), but all of CMENE do. > > I will continue to use the language baseline terminology, insofar as is > possible. > > lojbab > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > --=20 mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. --001a11c26a30d942e604ded80956 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yeah, I'm pretty sure CMENE is a klesi, and not a selma'o.

<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 8:33 PM, John E Clifford = <kali9putra@yahoo.com> wrote:
Well, CLL does not list a selma'= ;o CMENE in the list of all the selma'o. It does use selma'o style = reference ("CMENE") in two rules, one of them merely the phonolog= ical definition of what are now called cmevla, the other defining the multi= -cmevla cmene, which are called cmene=A0 and are clearly not in CMENE.=A0 N= one of the other things that are names, e.g., {la tsani} are called cmene e= ither and even regular cmevla and cmevla strings are called names throughou= t most of the text (other than the section on the phonological definition).= =A0 So, nobody is really sticking to CLL too closely.=A0 A nomenclature con= ference might come in handy.=A0 Personally, I like "names".


From: Robert LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org>
To:<= /span> loj= ban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2013= 6:37 PM

Subject:= Re: [lojban] cmevla as a class of brivla

Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote:
> I'll wait for you to read the context t= hen.
>
>
>=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 (I still don't know what a= "cmevla" is.=A0 I know what a "cmene" is)
>
&= gt;
> A cmevla is any Lojban word that ends in a consonant.
>
> = Examples of (single) cmene that are not (single) cmevla are: "la'o= gy
> Starbucks gy", "la djan smit", "la selpa= 9;i"
>
> It is useful to be able to distinguish the special word form &= quot;cmevla"
> from the more general notion of cmene. These two = concepts used to be
> confused when cmevla were called cmene, since n= ot all cmene have the
> form of cmevla.

CMENE is the name of the selma'o that consi= sts of those things you are
calling cmevla.

So not all cmene hav= e the morphology of CMENE (since not all cmene are
Lojban at all), but = all of CMENE do.

I will continue to use the language baseline terminology, insofar as is
possible.

lojbab

--
You received this message = because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an= email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at = http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.



--
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For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
=A0
=A0



--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. = :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
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