Received: from mail-pa0-f60.google.com ([209.85.220.60]:52283) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1UnT3L-0008Mh-Dj for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Fri, 14 Jun 2013 05:24:40 -0700 Received: by mail-pa0-f60.google.com with SMTP id kl14sf158623pab.15 for ; Fri, 14 Jun 2013 05:24:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=6IFYxoN0SFRfaSHwL2bQjw4Kd/6NVhMb4PZdyiVaxSM=; b=AoPwpuM6SlJ/0T23oJ5u1ftP4ftvhkQXg89IP13RGZvayI+QHBrqhl8mjX5nODzZmD i2WMvOuYxXoMR4yCu2qGRyg7lIQWr3pXza+btMWm1B17vgOlWp1QbGEzPOT5KNlQbTu2 jmyNZOuE9fQpsdVE4N1w4LLzW6T4B4oH9plLztlRryr1lj0QH1/UXwJ7uOZczSMnW1zO RHqQm75EH0GCb4G+yf4nCzHrUbgBT01U7W4/7zXiiS+PmFfWc1BbsiGYXfGWovJ83o/Y uHBQqnS1rknF0WIe3m7qktV5DEHhmJc7jkK2ZHbJfKNzVbQPTwHCBhLxF5nTctFy+5w2 1ugQ== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=6IFYxoN0SFRfaSHwL2bQjw4Kd/6NVhMb4PZdyiVaxSM=; b=ISjWjXHEtg1g87oApbORMfBPPn2Hx5k18KT6sSllZHHg3sfxUZeAeHxU29DTIAgcOl o2vwd4QqoIx+2pJx41dLxXze3kSxNgHqcyBWQTEMaUIOL5Mx8d1gkuzm+kTqTVMkMSiw vOKQhYSB2cDHidRArMbQAU/PuLBklvihX5hOhUtfPTba83pK7TLdVa/15wIO/yZkP5Os nSKg4eVGM/QIOsPAPR1YJqcDGhvlo381psLjp1/wP+Hwzj7DkZfCIAGj+ppSFuE+sCAf AZX5jB3xggo+IoK2M41DXoQvJ8ySwB8ccomlN8Z2kZdYZQYwGpM2YEz6HB+jwSSSiS5I WmkA== X-Received: by 10.49.105.229 with SMTP id gp5mr41971qeb.35.1371212660440; Fri, 14 Jun 2013 05:24:20 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.59.74 with SMTP id x10ls201520qeq.9.gmail; Fri, 14 Jun 2013 05:24:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.49.47.10 with SMTP id z10mr45813qem.7.1371212658332; Fri, 14 Jun 2013 05:24:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 14 Jun 2013 05:24:17 -0700 (PDT) From: la arxokuna To: lojban@googlegroups.com Message-Id: <5c9164ea-8238-4d3b-a241-496d818bd0e7@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: References: <0457f359-c515-465c-8e11-7e12f1d9e6bb@googlegroups.com> <509827ED.6040603@gmail.com> <50983198.9070305@gmx.de> <509837C3.5030207@gmx.de> <50984A9B.1010806@gmx.de> <509EDCFC.8070504@gmx.de> <509EF14D.8000403@gmx.de> <7c3c3bcb-4a42-48a8-84e5-4b57acdab273@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: [lojban] Translating "as" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_703_13529337.1371212657914" X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / ------=_Part_703_13529337.1371212657914 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Friday, June 14, 2013 3:56:38 PM UTC+4, gejyspa wrote: > > "xekri je mlatu" is not any amount of objects. It's a selbri. "lo xekri > je mlatu" is an object. "xekri je mlatu" is a description of all objects > that are both black and cats. > Okay. 1. How would you describe one object that is black and white but at different time? 2. How would you describe two objects, one black and another one white? > --gejsypa > > > > > On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 2:44 AM, la arxokuna > > wrote: > >> >> >> On Sunday, November 11, 2012 4:50:40 AM UTC+4, xorxes wrote: >> >>> On Sat, Nov 10, 2012 at 9:29 PM, selpa'i wrote: >>> > >>> > I think you can attach the "qua" tag with a {be} or {pe} to attach it >>> to one >>> > of the arguments. >>> >>> If you are happy with "pe" for that, then you don't need anything else: >>> >>> xu zo menli poi cmene cu melbi do >>> >>> "poi" would be used to restrict to a particular aspect or capacity of >>> an individual rather than to some particular individual(s) from a set. >>> (That sort of matches the etymology of "qua" too.) >>> >> >> >> Of course one can create any experimental cmavo. And we could imagine a >> {vo'o'oi} (selmaho NOI) that would distribute over properties of the same >> object rather than individuals. >> But it's all philosophy (see the thread on object vs. properties vs. >> process languages). >> >> But in this case we should solve the same problem for conjunctions. >> What is {xekri je mlatu}? One black cat or two objects, one black and >> another one being a cat? >> >> >> >> >>> >>> mu'o mi'e xorxes >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "lojban" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com . >> To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com >> . >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. >> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> >> >> > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. ------=_Part_703_13529337.1371212657914 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Friday, June 14, 2013 3:56:38 PM UTC+4, gejyspa wrote:
"xekri je mlatu" is not= any amount of objects.  It's a selbri.  "lo xekri je mlatu" is a= n object. "xekri je mlatu" is a description of  all objects that are b= oth black and cats.

Okay. 
=
1. How would you describe one object that is black and white but at di= fferent time?
2. How would you describe two objects, one black an= d another one white?


    --gejsypa


<= /div>


On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 2:44 A= M, la arxokuna <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:


On Sunday, November 11, 2012 4:50:40= AM UTC+4, xorxes wrote:
On Sat, Nov 10, 2012 at 9:29 PM, selpa'i <sel...@gmx.de> wrote= :
>
> I think you can attach the "qua" tag with a {be} or {pe} to attach= it to one
> of the arguments.

If you are happy with "pe" for that, then you don't need anything else:

xu zo menli poi cmene cu melbi do

"poi" would be used to restrict to a particular aspect or capacity of
an individual rather than to some particular individual(s) from a set.
(That sort of matches the etymology of "qua" too.)


Of course one can= create any experimental cmavo. And we could imagine a {vo'o'oi} (selmaho N= OI) that would distribute over properties of the same object rather than in= dividuals.
But it's all philosophy (see the thread on object vs. properties vs. p= rocess languages).

But in this case we should solv= e the same problem for conjunctions.
What is {xekri je mlatu}? On= e black cat or two objects, one black and another one being a cat?
 

 

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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=
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For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
 
 

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