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Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2013 18:04:19 -0400
Message-ID: <CA+gZtg+Z5G30sNjBiOtOxFwE5Js=4uwM3T9Sd2MftKHxjoG88Q@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] A bug in the CLL 7.6 example 6.14).
From: Ian Johnson <blindbravado@gmail.com>
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Useful examples of {nei} are somewhat hard to produce. As selbri or even
seltau it is essentially useless, because the result is recursive; this is
the case for 6.14. Even as sumti it's not that common, in my experience, to
need {lo SE nei} and be unable to use both {vo'V} and {ri}, since this
means you need nesting and a nested bridi with > 2 sumti in it.

mi'e la latro'a mu'o


On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 2:46 PM, la arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com>wr=
ote:

> http://dag.github.io/cll/7/6/
>
> For good examples of =93nei=94 and =93no'a=94, we need nested bridi conte=
xts:
>
> 6.14)  mi se pluka le nu do pensi
>              le nu nei kei pu le nu do zukte
>        I am-pleased-by the event-of (you think-about
>              (the event-of [main bridi]) before the-event of (your acting=
).
>        I am pleased that you thought about whether I
>              would be pleased (about ...) before you acted.
> 6.15)  mi ba klama ca le nu do no'a
>        I [future] go [present] the event-of you [repeats outer bridi]
>        I will go when you do.
>
>
> Acc. to jvs {nei} =3D pro-bridi: repeats the current bridi.
>
> So the CLL contradicts it.
>
> I also don't understand the meaning of example 6.14) if we assume {nei}
> refers to the current bridi, not the main bridi (the one that has {se
> pluka} as a selbri).
>
> I suggest removing 6.14) and replacing it with something having the
> correct usage of {nei}.
> I suggested {mi lumci lo nei} (I wash myself) but JCowan said there could
> be much better examples.
>
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>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Useful examples of {nei} are somewhat hard to produce. As =
selbri or even seltau it is essentially useless, because the result is recu=
rsive; this is the case for 6.14. Even as sumti it&#39;s not that common, i=
n my experience, to need {lo SE nei} and be unable to use both {vo&#39;V} a=
nd {ri}, since this means you need nesting and a nested bridi with &gt; 2 s=
umti in it.<br>
<br>mi&#39;e la latro&#39;a mu&#39;o<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><b=
r><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 2:46 PM, la arxoku=
na <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com" targ=
et=3D"_blank">gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><a href=3D"http://dag.github.io/cll/7/6/" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">http://dag.github.io/cll/7/6/</a><br><div><br></div><div><p=
 style=3D"line-height:normal;text-indent:1em;font-size:medium;font-family:s=
ans-serif">
For good examples of =93nei=94 and =93no&#39;a=94, we need nested bridi con=
texts:</p><pre style=3D"background-color:rgb(242,242,242);padding:0.4em"><a=
 name=3D"13f4e4f82b0171d7_e14">6.14)</a>  mi se pluka le nu do pensi
             le nu nei kei pu le nu do zukte
       I am-pleased-by the event-of (you think-about
             (the event-of [main bridi]) before the-event of (your acting).
       I am pleased that you thought about whether I
             would be pleased (about ...) before you acted.

<a name=3D"13f4e4f82b0171d7_e15">6.15)</a>  mi ba klama ca le nu do no&#39;=
a
       I [future] go [present] the event-of you [repeats outer bridi]
       I will go when you do.</pre></div><div><br></div><div>Acc. to jvs {n=
ei} =3D pro-bridi: repeats the current bridi.</div><div><br></div><div>So t=
he CLL=A0contradicts it.</div><div><br></div><div>I also don&#39;t understa=
nd the meaning of example 6.14) if we assume {nei} refers to the current br=
idi, not the main bridi (the one that has {se pluka} as a selbri).</div>
<div><br></div><div>I suggest removing 6.14) and replacing it with somethin=
g having the correct usage of {nei}.</div><div>I suggested {mi lumci lo nei=
} (I wash myself) but JCowan said there could be much better examples.</div=
>
<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888">

<p></p>

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=A0<br>
=A0<br>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div>

<p></p>

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