Received: from mail-qa0-f63.google.com ([209.85.216.63]:35015) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1UqjcL-0002rP-V3 for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Sun, 23 Jun 2013 05:42:12 -0700 Received: by mail-qa0-f63.google.com with SMTP id i13sf1004135qae.28 for ; Sun, 23 Jun 2013 05:41:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=S8hsr/UHfKnYhGrhG1ZiR80KDsfas2+elsBr3iTwmIE=; b=AcKK8XFT24MSZ17UjaYeK0PwIILXAY5fhhpbKoUZeERmtsgyaWaLVYQTkM3Iz8MZNA 6W6lRdXpLMW12qgONCrQ1ob0iU3msSe36/TJrk1xR1+4QBKyTwESumWoUNrA7a7OmbYv czjeG8rGafwI2KlVx9D3kVAtXWHqaAnfJJc8+qXJU9cKItzr1fwE1doFnFtH3aosU4JK tmwvT/+6e1mNhh3baLoa1GoxAg7TnCGX3+9x8gt8tSsehhtQGu0wQ8Tar9Don0Yr5pyY F36r69wW88UkLsgYlefzH2co8/guMFzbzcHqbuR1huEmOR8EcXGethl91/s+3yC50Fu+ z9Og== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=S8hsr/UHfKnYhGrhG1ZiR80KDsfas2+elsBr3iTwmIE=; b=cRkZrPPPfoOr9Za6k5Ywl2oHXStyT0qCMwnzINguTJabbanwTqtJ92OBAQ2/jNl11M 1gw6dLkbCMF3cwjuNknXFDdEO0pEVNN8UCC/6qDM83Gj7DnS6j7ofho8sbHsVhgtt7vw BIHHeAoiRKpW8k5bdVk9+YioVtvs9LPJXZtURNYO42Gh+wlhaNKlNbm5Wdw2UT4bflL/ kUypQyBEdDBQNqlWlzXvifvZX9RCeFRXJ7lbSGvG5enkvhxJzXmZXw/eV1nsofljmjVQ Qo/RcgESZk1+6vd/vo5QOTz2xTpFjBmt90LRIaUOWcarWNrMwkjDsfe6YaslKyWFdM9k irlw== X-Received: by 10.49.58.242 with SMTP id u18mr441099qeq.23.1371991319485; Sun, 23 Jun 2013 05:41:59 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.71.210 with SMTP id x18ls1746459qeu.85.gmail; Sun, 23 Jun 2013 05:41:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.49.120.67 with SMTP id la3mr447542qeb.35.1371991319168; Sun, 23 Jun 2013 05:41:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2013 05:41:58 -0700 (PDT) From: =?UTF-8?B?0JDQvdCw0YLQvtC70LjQuSDQk9Cw0YjQtdCy?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com Message-Id: <2d346b25-b744-4f11-9fcb-65211de46c48@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: <20130623121840.GI32044@samsa.fritz.box> References: <5d7f238f-ff93-40ab-af24-fc6320d91b23@googlegroups.com> <199f9de9-f0bb-4cbb-bd8e-e124b45d5d1d@googlegroups.com> <20130623121840.GI32044@samsa.fritz.box> Subject: Re: [lojban] Please, the best explanation of {le} vs. {lo} MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: volishavas@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_5_2996683.1371991318848" X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / ------=_Part_5_2996683.1371991318848 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Using here {le nanmu} is not better and actually it might be wrong. Cuz it= =20 may be that I just now saw a woman, which I described as a man and I think= =20 the person is a man. He/she has not any specific meaning for me at all that is why I called=20 him/her {lo nanmu}, but not {le ninmu}. Please, everybody, read xorlo-update already cuz the {lo}-meaning has=20 changed dramatically since CLL, which is dated by 1997. =D7=CF=D3=CB=D2=C5=D3=C5=CE=D8=C5, 23 =C9=C0=CE=D1 2013 =C7., 18:18:40 UTC+= 6 =D0=CF=CC=D8=DA=CF=D7=C1=D4=C5=CC=D8 v4hn =CE=C1=D0=C9=D3=C1=CC: > > On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 03:21:50AM -0700, =E1=CE=C1=D4=CF=CC=C9=CA =E7=C1= =DB=C5=D7 wrote:=20 > > I may call a woman with {lo nanmu} if I think the person is a man.=20 > > You can ask about that almost anybody, especially la tsani or la=20 > selpa'i.=20 > > And they can say am I right or not.=20 > > Yes, you can do that. Obviously. How else would you describe someone=20 > who seems to be a man?=20 > > Nevertheless, you say something ba'e wrong then.=20 > Using {le nanmu} (which in my opinion is better style anyway when you=20 > have someone specific in mind) you do not, because you refer to=20 > a specific individual no matter the description.=20 > > > v4hn=20 > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. ------=_Part_5_2996683.1371991318848 Content-Type: text/html; charset=KOI8-R Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Using here {le nanmu} is not better and actually it might be wrong. Cuz it = may be that I just now saw a woman, which I described as a man and I think = the person is a man.
He/she has not any specific meaning for me at all t= hat is why I called him/her {lo nanmu}, but not {le ninmu}.
Please, ever= ybody, read xorlo-update already cuz the {lo}-meaning has changed dramatica= lly since CLL, which is dated by 1997.

=D7=CF=D3=CB=D2=C5=D3=C5=CE= =D8=C5, 23 =C9=C0=CE=D1 2013 =C7., 18:18:40 UTC+6 =D0=CF=CC=D8=DA=CF= =D7=C1=D4=C5=CC=D8 v4hn =CE=C1=D0=C9=D3=C1=CC:
On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 03:21:50AM -0700, =E1=CE=C1=D4=CF= =CC=C9=CA =E7=C1=DB=C5=D7 wrote:
> I may call a woman with {lo nanmu} if I think the person is a man.
> You can ask about that almost anybody, especially la tsani or la s= elpa'i.=20
> And they can say am I right or not.

Yes, you can do that. Obviously. How else would you describe someone
who seems to be a man?

Nevertheless, you say something ba'e wrong then.
Using {le nanmu} (which in my opinion is better style anyway when you
have someone specific in mind) you do not, because you refer to
a specific individual no matter the description.


v4hn

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