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From: MorphemeAddict <lytlesw@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2013 03:05:43 -0500
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Subject: Re: [lojban] An Interesting Use for a Rafsi
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Okay, thanks. I didn't know that. I must sound like an illiterate
programming hack when I speak.

stevo


On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 11:31 PM, Cyril Slobin <cyril@slobin.pp.ru> wrote:

> >> In Esperanto, e.g., it's obvious which is meant: "ne devas iri" vs.
> "devas ne iri";
> >> Russian (i.a.) shares this, I believe.
>
> Alas Russian shares the problem with English: "=CE=C5 =C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE =
=C9=C4=D4=C9" *is*
> ambiguous. If you must be clear with the first meaning, you just
> change the verb from "=C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE" (must) to "=CF=C2=D1=DA=C1=CE" =
(obliged). "=CE=C5 =CF=C2=D1=DA=C1=CE
> =C9=C4=D4=C9" is absolutely clear the first meaning, not second.
>
> On the other hand, "=C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE =CE=C5 =C9=C4=D4=C9" has clear sec=
ond meaning, but is,
> strictly speaking, illiterate. This form is used mainly by people that
> know some programming language, and can be considered as a hack
> speech.
>
> In normal literate text, without weird logical assumptions, the
> average reader would most likely understand "=CE=C5 =C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE =
=C9=C4=D4=C9" in a
> second meaning.
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:courier =
new,monospace">Okay, thanks. I didn&#39;t know that. I must sound like an i=
lliterate programming hack when I speak.=9A</div><div class=3D"gmail_defaul=
t" style=3D"font-family:courier new,monospace">

<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:courier new,mon=
ospace">stevo</div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><br><div class=3D"g=
mail_quote">On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 11:31 PM, Cyril Slobin <span dir=3D"ltr"=
>&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cyril@slobin.pp.ru" target=3D"_blank">cyril@slobin.p=
p.ru</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"im">&gt;&gt; In Esperanto, e.g=
., it&#39;s obvious which is meant: &quot;ne devas iri&quot; vs. &quot;deva=
s ne iri&quot;;<br>


&gt;&gt; Russian (i.a.) shares this, I believe.<br>
<br>
</div>Alas Russian shares the problem with English: &quot;=CE=C5 =C4=CF=CC=
=D6=C5=CE =C9=C4=D4=C9&quot; *is*<br>
ambiguous. If you must be clear with the first meaning, you just<br>
change the verb from &quot;=C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE&quot; (must) to &quot;=CF=C2=
=D1=DA=C1=CE&quot; (obliged). &quot;=CE=C5 =CF=C2=D1=DA=C1=CE<br>
=C9=C4=D4=C9&quot; is absolutely clear the first meaning, not second.<br>
<br>
On the other hand, &quot;=C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE =CE=C5 =C9=C4=D4=C9&quot; has c=
lear second meaning, but is,<br>
strictly speaking, illiterate. This form is used mainly by people that<br>
know some programming language, and can be considered as a hack<br>
speech.<br>
<br>
In normal literate text, without weird logical assumptions, the<br>
average reader would most likely understand &quot;=CE=C5 =C4=CF=CC=D6=C5=CE=
 =C9=C4=D4=C9&quot; in a<br>
second meaning.<br>
<div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

<p></p>

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