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Subject: Re: [lojban] Lexicon Valley: Will Learning a "Logical" Language Make
 You Think More Logically?
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From: "John E. Clifford" <kali9putra@yahoo.com>
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Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2013 20:58:54 -0600
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 Content preview:  Yes. This effect is noticed with learning any slightly different
    language and is not related to logicality per se. Sent from my iPad On Dec
    11, 2013, at 20:11, lorxus <coronacoreanici@gmail.com> wrote: [...] 
 
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Yes.  This effect is noticed with learning any slightly different language =
and is not related to logicality per se.

Sent from my iPad

On Dec 11, 2013, at 20:11, lorxus <coronacoreanici@gmail.com> wrote:

> For my part, I have noticed a slight but significant increase in my clari=
ty of thought now that I have begun to be even slightly fluent in Lojban. I=
n forcing you to examine why you want to say something, (think xamgu vs. vr=
ude, djica constructions, etc.) it improves your ability to think, just a l=
ittle.
>=20
> On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 3:43:41 PM UTC-5, clifford wrote:
> Well, it has the history somewhat skewed and almost all the usual errors =
about the Whorf Hypothesis, but a decent sketch of what most people and Wik=
ipedia think this is all about.  And no, logical languages don't make ou mo=
re logical nor does the hypothesis nor JCB in his saner moments claim they =
would.
>=20
> Sent from my iPad
>=20
> On Dec 11, 2013, at 5:24, Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
>> http://www.slate.com/articles/podcasts/lexicon_valley/2013/12/lexicon_va=
lley_lojban_is_an_invented_language_that_aims_to_be_supremely.html
>>=20
>> The Whorf Hypothesis, named after early 20th-century linguist Benjamin W=
horf, postulates that the language we speak affects the way we think. In ot=
her words, speakers of different languages experience slightly different re=
alities. The only problem is there's no way to test it. Languages, after al=
l, are closely tied to cultures, which also influence the way we perceive t=
he world, and it's impossible to tease out one from the other. That's where=
 James Cooke Brown comes in. He wanted to create a "logical" language and t=
each it to people under laboratory conditions. If it made them more logical=
 then Whorf would be proven right! Listen to Bob Garfield and Mike Vuolo di=
scuss Logical Language with Arika Okrent, author of In the Land of Invented=
 Languages: Esperanto Rock Stars, Klingon Poets, Loglan Lovers, and the Mad=
 Dreamers Who Tried to Build a Perfect Language.
>> --=20
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Group=
s "lojban" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send a=
n email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>=20
> --=20
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 "lojban" group.
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 email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban.
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<html><head></head><body bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div>Yes. &nbsp;This effect is=
 noticed with learning any slightly different language and is not related t=
o logicality per se.<br><br>Sent from my iPad</div><div><br>On Dec 11, 2013=
, at 20:11, lorxus &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:coronacoreanici@gmail.com">coronac=
oreanici@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type=
=3D"cite"><div><div dir=3D"ltr">For my part, I have noticed a slight but si=
gnificant increase in my clarity of thought now that I have begun to be eve=
n slightly fluent in Lojban. In forcing you to examine why you want to say =
something, (think xamgu vs. vrude, djica constructions, etc.) it improves y=
our ability to think, just a little.<br><br>On Wednesday, December 11, 2013=
 3:43:41 PM UTC-5, clifford wrote:<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: =
1ex;"><div bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div>Well, it has the history somewhat skewe=
d and almost all the usual errors about the Whorf Hypothesis, but a decent =
sketch of what most people and Wikipedia think this is all about. &nbsp;And=
 no, logical languages don't make ou more logical nor does the hypothesis n=
or JCB in his saner moments claim they would.<br><br>Sent from my iPad</div=
><div><br>On Dec 11, 2013, at 5:24, Gleki Arxokuna &lt;<a href=3D"javascrip=
t:" target=3D"_blank" gdf-obfuscated-mailto=3D"-p52MqA9MxQJ" onmousedown=3D=
"this.href=3D'javascript:';return true;" onclick=3D"this.href=3D'javascript=
:';return true;">gleki.is...@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div></d=
iv><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"http://www.sl=
ate.com/articles/podcasts/lexicon_valley/2013/12/lexicon_valley_lojban_is_a=
n_invented_language_that_aims_to_be_supremely.html" target=3D"_blank" onmou=
sedown=3D"this.href=3D'http://www.google.com/url?q\75http%3A%2F%2Fwww.slate=
.com%2Farticles%2Fpodcasts%2Flexicon_valley%2F2013%2F12%2Flexicon_valley_lo=
jban_is_an_invented_language_that_aims_to_be_supremely.html\46sa\75D\46sntz=
\0751\46usg\75AFQjCNEt0ovA7fEAoOW401Yw9v9tyZXXUg';return true;" onclick=3D"=
this.href=3D'http://www.google.com/url?q\75http%3A%2F%2Fwww.slate.com%2Fart=
icles%2Fpodcasts%2Flexicon_valley%2F2013%2F12%2Flexicon_valley_lojban_is_an=
_invented_language_that_aims_to_be_supremely.html\46sa\75D\46sntz\0751\46us=
g\75AFQjCNEt0ovA7fEAoOW401Yw9v9tyZXXUg';return true;">http://www.slate.com/=
articles/<wbr>podcasts/lexicon_valley/2013/<wbr>12/lexicon_valley_lojban_is=
_<wbr>an_invented_language_that_<wbr>aims_to_be_supremely.html</a><br>
<div><br></div><div>The Whorf Hypothesis, named after early 20th-century li=
nguist Benjamin Whorf, postulates that the language we speak affects the wa=
y we think. In other words, speakers of different languages experience slig=
htly different realities. The only problem is there's no way to test it. La=
nguages, after all, are closely tied to cultures, which also influence the =
way we perceive the world, and it's impossible to tease out one from the ot=
her. That's where James Cooke Brown comes in. He wanted to create a "logica=
l" language and teach it to people under laboratory conditions. If it made =
them more logical then Whorf would be proven right! Listen to Bob Garfield =
and Mike Vuolo discuss Logical Language with Arika Okrent, author of In the=
 Land of Invented Languages: Esperanto Rock Stars, Klingon Poets, Loglan Lo=
vers, and the Mad Dreamers Who Tried to Build a Perfect Language.<br>
</div></div>

<p></p>

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</div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div>

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