Received: from mail-pd0-f187.google.com ([209.85.192.187]:55080) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1W0YYj-0005vq-LU for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:21 -0800 Received: by mail-pd0-f187.google.com with SMTP id q10sf123915pdj.14 for ; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=7apnIdy+xFbFPmVgecg3kKB16MLDw9eBQiO/cODpkEo=; b=MjTYYdzuypmJlqRcII4/zIhHqmFSGx7DXgW42BAu1qTVz6lq0ZKpnSdnJwak1Or+mL QCvfycgrNox9aysqCTefAziPmtQnMpNQzNh4tKY4q+C7KDbUASfwkkUS9uVoB4ZSUIQU IKQo61WyTwragwn8xaKrlummcK0ZtSfzUJpOn9RS61mlrCIX6eNVhYLAI+fDES0Hknj0 mQduo4dDpIL8F+5kn+bjcZGdGw+pIyqOREhwRduXy6jNy1sAFlKkq5d4efYO7YWieNRM pMrCQkUmgsgg2ubKwfhg/6F+rV3Pjb1NpOFZ9Ojhd1DiyYhGUYTZK/2J/Xq3sZ7odsbJ k0Ng== X-Received: by 10.50.78.230 with SMTP id e6mr415641igx.15.1389108427496; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:07 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.73.195 with SMTP id n3ls1941306igv.41.canary; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.66.240.4 with SMTP id vw4mr2166060pac.10.1389108426815; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ie0-x231.google.com (mail-ie0-x231.google.com [2607:f8b0:4001:c03::231]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id i24si5224431yhe.6.2014.01.07.07.27.06 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of felipeg.assis@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c03::231 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4001:c03::231; Received: by mail-ie0-f177.google.com with SMTP id tp5so514021ieb.36 for ; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.43.61.196 with SMTP id wx4mr60711420icb.6.1389108426282; Tue, 07 Jan 2014 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.223.166 with HTTP; Tue, 7 Jan 2014 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <52CB3AC2.3070507@gmx.de> <0413ea89-18e2-42df-8725-f150e2eb34e9@googlegroups.com> Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2014 13:27:06 -0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] [oz] Use of elidable {cu} From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Felipe_Gon=E7alves_Assis?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: felipeg.assis@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of felipeg.assis@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c03::231 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=felipeg.assis@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec51dd1f14d9c9704ef630250 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --bcaec51dd1f14d9c9704ef630250 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In http://users.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/hobbies/lojban/grammar/lojban.peg= .txt (where can I find the file used by camxes?) There is this rule term-1 <- sumti / ( !gek (tag / FA-clause free*) (sumti / KU-clause? free*) ) / termset / NA-clause KU-clause free* I don't have a firm grasp of formal grammars, so correct me if I am wrong. 1. This rule is relevant. 2. If we make the KU-clause mandatory, instead of optional, my mental grammar is realized. term-1 <- sumti / ( !gek (tag / FA-clause free*) (sumti / KU-clause free*) ) / termset / NA-clause KU-clause free* 3. It would contradict the CLL, though. http://dag.github.io/cll/9/9/ Fact is I didn't internalize the elidability of {ku} in this case. I still don't like it... mu'o mi'e .asiz. On 7 January 2014 10:05, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > > > > On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 4:15 AM, guskant wrote: > >> Le mardi 7 janvier 2014 11:07:38 UTC+9, xorxes a =E9crit : >> >>> >>> I did propose once that tags should have priority in their function as >>> selbri tags over their function as sumti tags. >>> >> > >> Then why are peg parsers against your proposition and jbofi'e and CLL? >> Is it a bug, or an intended behavior? >> > > You'd have to ask Robin that. He probably didn't bother with the "lo brod= a > pu brode" case because the meaning is not really changed either way, The > "lo nu broda pu brode" case is handled the same by both parsers, and it m= ay > be what CLL calls a "very complex sentence". > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. --bcaec51dd1f14d9c9704ef630250 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
In
http://users.digital= kingdom.org/~rlpowell/hobbies/lojban/grammar/lojban.peg.txt
(where c= an I find the file used by camxes?)
There is this rule

term-1 <- sumti / ( !gek (tag / FA-clause free= *) (sumti / KU-clause? free*) ) / termset / NA-clause KU-clause free*

I don't have a firm grasp of formal grammars, so correct me if I = am wrong.

1. This rule is relevant.
2. If we make the KU-clause mandatory, ins= tead of optional, my mental grammar is realized.

term-1 <- sumti = / ( !gek (tag / FA-clause free*) (sumti / KU-clause free*) ) / termset / NA= -clause KU-clause free*

3. It would contradict the CLL, though. http://dag.github.io/cll/9/9/

Fact is I d= idn't internalize the elidability of {ku} in this case. I still don'= ;t like it...

mu'o
mi'e .asiz.




On 7 Januar= y 2014 10:05, Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com> wro= te:



On Tue, Jan 7, 201= 4 at 4:15 AM, guskant <gusni.kantu@gmail.com> wrote:
Le mardi 7 janvier 2014 11:07:38 UT= C+9, xorxes a =E9crit=A0:

I did propose once that tags should h= ave priority in their function as selbri tags over their function as sumti = tags.=A0
=A0
=A0Then why are peg parsers against your proposi= tion and jbofi'e and CLL?
Is it a bug, or an intended behavio= r?

You'd have t= o ask Robin that. He probably didn't bother with the "lo broda pu = brode" case because the meaning is not really changed either way, The = "lo nu broda pu brode" case is handled the same by both parsers, = and it may be what CLL calls a "very complex sentence".

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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