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Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 19:33:37 -0200
Message-ID: <CAO7tK2cVvebFYD9r-eLFfJPSuBBvicTjno0cHm1+jhzPRQYd4w@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] Individuals and xorlo
From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= <jjllambias@gmail.com>
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 Content preview:  On Thu, Feb 6, 2014 at 8:33 AM, selpa'i <seladwa@gmx.de> wrote:
    > la .guskant. cu cusku di'e > >> >> If you suggest another short term for
    "something in a domain of plural >> variable, saying nothing about collectivity/distributivity",
    I would >> abandon my usage of "mass" in this meaning. >> > > A term that
    I've been using, but which doesn't seem to be very wide-spread > (yet?),
   is "individual-collection". Anything that can be expressed as {X > jo'u Y
   jo'u Z ...} is an individual collection and is identical to a {lo > broda}
    with those {jo'u}-connected referents. [...] 
 
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On Thu, Feb 6, 2014 at 8:33 AM, selpa'i <seladwa@gmx.de> wrote:

> la .guskant. cu cusku di'e
>
>>
>>  If you suggest another short term for "something in a domain of plural
>> variable, saying nothing about collectivity/distributivity", I would
>> abandon my usage of "mass" in this meaning.
>>
>
> A term that I've been using, but which doesn't seem to be very wide-spread
> (yet?), is "individual-collection". Anything that can be expressed as {X
> jo'u Y jo'u Z ...} is an individual collection and is identical to a {lo
> broda} with those {jo'u}-connected referents.


The problem with that, with whatever term is chosen in the metalanguage to
talk about the language, is that the term eventually leaks into the
language, and then collections become individuals too. That happened to
"mass" very quickly, probably from the start, compounded with the problem
that it was used for a lot of other things and not just for plural
reference. I prefer to say that the domain of plural variables is just
individuals, not something else, but that variables don't need to take one
value at a time.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><br><div class=3D"gmail=
_quote">On Thu, Feb 6, 2014 at 8:33 AM, selpa&#39;i <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:seladwa@gmx.de" target=3D"_blank">seladwa@gmx.de</a>&gt;</=
span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"im">la .guskant. cu cusku di&#=
39;e<br>
</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br></blockquote><div class=3D"im">
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
If you suggest another short term for &quot;something in a domain of plural=
<br>
variable, saying nothing about collectivity/distributivity&quot;, I would<b=
r>
abandon my usage of &quot;mass&quot; in this meaning.<br>
</blockquote>
<br></div>
A term that I&#39;ve been using, but which doesn&#39;t seem to be very wide=
-spread (yet?), is &quot;individual-collection&quot;. Anything that can be =
expressed as {X jo&#39;u Y jo&#39;u Z ...} is an individual collection and =
is identical to a {lo broda} with those {jo&#39;u}-connected referents.</bl=
ockquote>
<div><br></div><div>The problem with that, with whatever term is chosen in =
the metalanguage to talk about the language, is that the term eventually le=
aks into the language, and then collections become individuals too. That ha=
ppened to &quot;mass&quot; very quickly, probably from the start, compounde=
d with the problem that it was used for a lot of other things and not just =
for plural reference. I prefer to say that the domain of plural variables i=
s just individuals, not something else, but that variables don&#39;t need t=
o take one value at a time.</div>
<div><br></div><div>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e xorxes</div><div>=A0=A0</div></div></=
div></div>

<p></p>

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