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Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2014 01:01:00 +0100
From: Wuzzy <almikes@aol.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban] {berti} - "to the north" or "northern side"?
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Am Thu, 27 Feb 2014 13:53:25 +0400
schrieb Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com>:

> {berti} =3D x1 is to the north/northern side [right-hand-rule pole] of
> x2 according to frame of reference x3.
>=20
> I think this is polysemous. {lo gusta cu berti lo tcadu mi} with me
> standing in the center of the city - does it mean that the restaurant
> is to the north of the city and outside the city or it is in the
> northern part of the city and thus within the borders of the city?
>=20

First: How can you be a frame of reference? I think the frame of
reference would be the Earth (or a simplified model, like WGS-84). So
your sentence seems nonsensical to me.

But still: This definition is indeed ambigious. It looks even
intentional, since the ambigiouty is introduced EXPLICITLY.
Actually, a lot of gismu are. I heard this was made in order to give
more freedom for lujvo.

Here=E2=80=99s an example: {badna}. Banana. Either the fruit OR the
plant. So in jbovlaste I created new lujvo for
disambiguation: =E2=80=9Cbadnygrute=E2=80=9D (banana, the fruit) and
=E2=80=9Cbadnyspa=E2=80=9D (banana, the plant).

With the definition =E2=80=9Cx1 is north of x2 according to frame of refere=
nce
x3=E2=80=9D I can live when x1 and x2 are two points.
But what does =E2=80=9Cx1 is to the northern side of x2 according to frame =
of
reference x3=E2=80=9D even mean? How do you know something is =E2=80=9Cthe =
northern=E2=80=9D
side of something? You would have to put an imaginary border somewhere,
where the =E2=80=9Cnorthern side=E2=80=9D ends.

I think the problem with berti could be solved with more lujvo. I
wonder how these lujvo should look like =E2=80=A6

--=20
Wuzzy

--=20
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