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Subject: Re: [lojban] Translating the Bible
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From: Sebastian <seb@lojban.se>
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Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2014 04:42:42 +0200
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Skickat fr=C3=A5n min iPhone

> 30 mar 2014 kl. 01:14 skrev Pierre Abbat <phma@bezitopo.org>:
>=20
> I think it's more important to dive in and start translating, rather than=
=20
> argue about philosophy of translation. That said, here's a passage that=
=20
> presents a problem:
>=20
> This morning, the verse (related somehow to the sermon) was Judges 12:6. =
The=20
> preacher is a native speaker of Spanish, which does not have the phoneme =
/=CA=83/=20
> (though Old Spanish did). Both the NVI and the RV have "shibolet/sibolet"=
. The=20
> LXX (Greek doesn't have /=CA=83/ either) says "=CE=9A=CE=B1=CE=B9 =CE=B5=
=CE=B9=CF=80=CE=B1=CE=BD =CE=B1=CF=85=CF=84=CF=89 =C2=AB=CE=95=CE=B9=CF=80=
=CE=BF=CE=BD =CE=B4=CE=B7 =CF=83=CF=84=CE=B1=CF=87=CF=85=CF=82=C2=BB =CE=BA=
=CE=B1=CE=B9=20
> =CE=BF=CF=85 =CE=BA=CE=B1=CF=84=CE=B5=CF=85=CE=B8=CF=85=CE=BD=CE=B5 =CF=
=84=CE=BF=CF=85 =CE=BB=CE=B1=CE=BB=CE=B7=CF=83=CE=B1=CE=B9 =CE=BF=CF=85=CF=
=84=CF=89=CF=82" (And they said to him, "So say stalk", and he=20
> was not correct in speaking thus). ("Shibboleth" is Hebrew for a grain st=
alk=20
> and also occurs in the dream of seven big ears and seven scrawny ears.) H=
ow=20
> should we render it in Lojban, which does have /=CA=83/?
>=20
> .i lo gliadi goi ko'e cu ga'orgau lo grestu be la .iordan. fo lo fraimi g=
oi=20
> fo'a .i lo fraimi cliva cu cusku lu .e'o mi pagre li'u .i ko'e retsku lu =
xu do=20
> fraimi li'u .i fo'a dafsku lu nago'i li'u .i ko'e mi'esku lu ko
> cusku zo stani=20
I would have translated it as:
"[...] lu ko cusku zo'oi cibolet [...]"

The important thing here is the pronunciation of a certain word to test the=
ir cultural membership. The meaning of the word doesn't really matter in th=
is context. Or you could just add a footnote with an explanation.

> li'u .i fo'a naldra bacru cusku zo ctani .isemu'ibo ko'e catra fo'a ba'e =
bu'u=20
> lo grestu be la .iordan.
>=20
> mu'omi'e .pier.
> --=20
> sei do'anai mi'a djuno puze'e noroi nalselganse srera
>=20
> --=20
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