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Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2014 20:14:31 +0200
From: Wuzzy <almikes@aol.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban] What are the most important fu'ivla and cimjvo?
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Am Wed, 9 Apr 2014 12:55:30 +0400
schrieb Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com>:

> We know that gimste represents more or less most basic concepts.
> But what about fu'ivla and cimjvo?
> Although, we have a frequency dictionary what are in your opinion the
> most important of them?
I thing those so-called =E2=80=9Ccimjvo=E2=80=9D (what a silly word! An .u'=
ivla,
really! xD) are super rare in Lojban. I can=E2=80=99t you give any new exam=
ples
and I don=E2=80=99t think they play a large role in Lojban. Metaphors are a=
n
exception in lujvo already. Dropping the pe'a as well is an exception
to an exception. So it=E2=80=99s no wonder I can=E2=80=99t name you such wo=
rds.
And that=E2=80=99s good. In Lojban, everything is to be taken literally exc=
ept
when otherwise stated. This is a very good idea in my eyes and I don=E2=80=
=99t
see why this principle should be broken.

Instead of translating such strange words, I think it may be more
appropriate to create a new word instead, one which does not need a
metaphor in the first place. At the very least, a new word where the
metaphor is explicit (with =E2=80=9Cpe'a=E2=80=9D) can always be created fr=
om the old
word.
I just did that with =E2=80=9Ccimjvo=E2=80=9D by creating =E2=80=9Cpevycimj=
vo=E2=80=9D. The definition
of =E2=80=9Ccimjvo=E2=80=9D is actually useful, it=E2=80=99s just the word =
that=E2=80=99s silly (to me).

BTW: I don=E2=80=99t count =E2=80=9Cfu'ivla=E2=80=9D as a an implicit metap=
hor lujvo. A loan
word is really just a =E2=80=9Ccopy word=E2=80=9D. You copy the word from o=
ne language
to another. Okay, maybe not EXACTLY copy it, but you get the idea. The
relations of rafsi in lujvo do not have to be 100% accurate. but that
does not make them to metaphors already.

I am unsure about =E2=80=9Czi'evla=E2=80=9D, however.

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