Received: from mail-ie0-f187.google.com ([209.85.223.187]:37798) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1Wt0fD-0007d8-JV for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:23:05 -0700 Received: by mail-ie0-f187.google.com with SMTP id x19sf706527ier.24 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=RONJWv9GzT/zNhGGmno2mdyEubXrkPUJHa6gFlcxK78=; b=zBSFNZzxjcvCArhyI0JSt3oWD3yWY6R1P1dSOlVFXo3ICesbhQOzDmOdgePUjh3pZO 0/Vph+rUIlRB0/MiCrFjwwd3adoDbbMnW9jRdLiYcw3sLvjc+KZngL0/mKr8Kqxujzb5 lPROly+fMuWVlLAjqpQIDW0B+OQ6NSwMLDeOD73hovez2CqDAmXCMbwxq5a6o6+CCRTr SM4ixI+iANAatCVEgYSSo8a7b693YNC2SyKH4hcYPOPRp96zhGUn79vyYqWTb8qll5NK u3QcZ/XzWiEsxfPf6h2BXVltOvtlQFp3ijW0T3jDpdashknHQYp1i2ertetNdb39Ghq0 oTZA== X-Received: by 10.182.249.72 with SMTP id ys8mr38971obc.9.1402086173531; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:53 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.182.126.134 with SMTP id my6ls434690obb.38.gmail; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.182.66.166 with SMTP id g6mr3018593obt.12.1402086171733; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ve0-x236.google.com (mail-ve0-x236.google.com [2607:f8b0:400c:c01::236]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id pr8si717891vdb.1.2014.06.06.13.22.51 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:51 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:400c:c01::236 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:400c:c01::236; Received: by mail-ve0-f182.google.com with SMTP id sa20so3923908veb.13 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:51 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.52.4.40 with SMTP id h8mr4465906vdh.95.1402086171605; Fri, 06 Jun 2014 13:22:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.170.73 with HTTP; Fri, 6 Jun 2014 13:22:51 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <53903D84.90502@gmx.de> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 17:22:51 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Specifying sumti types: another revision of gimste is complete From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jorge_Llamb=C3=ADas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:400c:c01::236 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3033444d3402a504fb30a027 X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - --20cf3033444d3402a504fb30a027 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 4:37 AM, Gleki Arxokuna wrote: > > 2014-06-06 3:08 GMT+04:00 Jorge Llamb=C3=ADas : > >> >> I think lerfu2 is not in general plural >> > > Then how would you describe lerfu2? As for types it can be either located > (aka "object/event") or text (e.g. letters). > Text is fine, but not plural. "lo ci se lerfu" to me is three alphabets, not three letters that constitute an alphabet. So lerfu2 is for the alphabets, not for the letters. But what about it being a set? Compare e.g. mlatu1 and lerfu2. What is it > that they they differ in? > If you mean "set" in the abstract set theoretical sense, then no, because alphabets can for example be recited (abstract sets can't), alphabets can evolve (abstract sets can't) and so on. If you mean "set" in a more general, everyday sense, then yes, alphabets are indeed sets of letters. Do you mean mlatu2? I don't think mlatu1 has much to do with sets. > If you do think they can both be named "sets" then of course i'll remove > this "set" as a role/type ... whatever you call it since then "set" would > be meaningless. > mlatu2 and lerfu2 are sets in a general sense. The word "set" shouldn't be a problem as long as it's not taken to mean the abstract objects of set theory, which is what the Lojban tradition has used it for. mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --20cf3033444d3402a504fb30a027 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

= On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 4:37 AM, Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@= gmail.com> wrote:
=
2014-06-06 3:08 GMT+04:00 Jorge Llamb=C3=ADa= s <jjllambias@gmail.com>:
=

I think lerfu2 is= not in general plural

Then how would you describe lerfu2? As for types = it can be either located (aka "object/event") or text (e.g. lette= rs).

Text is fi= ne, but not plural. "lo ci se lerfu" to me is three alphabets, no= t three letters that constitute an alphabet. So lerfu2 is for the alphabets= , not for the letters.

But what about it being a = set? Compare e.g. mlatu1 and lerfu2. What is it that they they differ in?

If you mean "= set" in the abstract set theoretical sense, then no, because alphabets= can for example be recited (abstract sets can't), alphabets can evolve= (abstract sets can't) and so on. If you mean "set" in a more= general, everyday sense, then yes, alphabets are indeed sets of letters.
=C2=A0
Do you mean mlatu2? I don't think mlatu1 has much= to do with sets.
=C2=A0
If you do think they can both be named "sets" then of course i= 9;ll remove this "set" as a role/type ... whatever you call it si= nce then "set" would be meaningless.

mlatu2 and lerfu2 are sets in a general se= nse. The word "set" shouldn't be a problem as long as it'= s not taken to mean the abstract objects of set theory, which is what the L= ojban tradition has used it for.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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