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Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2014 11:19:12 -0400
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Subject: Re: [lojban] vamji
From: Michael Turniansky <mturniansky@gmail.com>
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    As I did in Esther http://www.lojban.org/tiki/Esther , I think the key
here is to use "prali", rather than "vamji" in these type of constructions
"The film is well worth seeing" ->  lo nu catlu lo skina cu te prali [lo'e
prenu/do] .  Of course, in this case, it's also "lo nu lo skina cu xamgu
[lo'eprenu/do]"

        --gejyspa


On Sun, Apr 13, 2014 at 12:32 PM, Ilmen <ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com> wrote:

>  coi ro do
>
> The gismu {vamji} seems to be a promising word for translating "to be
> worth doing", as well as words such as "recommendable", "admirable",
> "unacceptable", "reprehensible/blameworthy", etc. (The -able/-ible suffix
> has several different meanings depending on the word it attaches to; most
> often it is {cumki} (-cu'i), but in the case of some words like these,
> {vamji} seems to be the adequate word.)
>
> However, I can't make sense of {vamji}'s argument structure:
>
>   vamji (value)
> =E2=80=94 x1 (ni) is the equivalent value/worth of x2 [item(s) of value] =
to x3 for
> use/appreciation x4
> =E2=80=94 [also: x2 is worth x1 to x3; (for x2 person:) x2 merits (one se=
nse),
> (adjective:) x2 is worthy (=3D selva'i for reordered places); merit rewar=
d (=3D
> nemselva'i); receive merited reward (=3D vamselne'u); x2 may be a specifi=
c
> object, a commodity (mass), an event, or a property; pedantically, for
> objects/commodities, this is sumti-raising from ownership of the
> object/commodity (=3D posyva'i, posyselva'i for unambiguous semantics)];
> (cf. jdima, jerna, vecnu, dirba, janta, kargu, pleji; see note at jdima o=
n
> cost/price/value distinction, vajni)
>
>
> Corpus usage of the arguments of {vamji} =E2=80=94with more than one argu=
ment
> place filled=E2=80=94 is scarce, and didn't help me much.
>
> Could somebody enlighten me by providing a couple of example sentences
> using all of {vamji}'s argument places? (Preferably not for monetary valu=
e
> usages, as {jdima} is a better word for that purpose.)
>
> For example, how would you translate =C2=ABThe film is well worth seeing.=
=C2=BB in
> Lojban?
>
> Thank you in advance,
> mi'e la .ilmen. mu'o
>
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 As I did in Esther <a href=3D"http://www.loj=
ban.org/tiki/Esther">http://www.lojban.org/tiki/Esther</a> , I think the ke=
y here is to use &quot;prali&quot;, rather than &quot;vamji&quot; in these =
type of constructions &quot;The film is well worth seeing&quot; -&gt; =C2=
=A0lo nu catlu lo skina cu te prali [lo&#39;e prenu/do] . =C2=A0Of course, =
in this case, it&#39;s also &quot;lo nu lo skina cu xamgu [lo&#39;eprenu/do=
]&quot;<div>
<br></div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 --gejyspa</div><div><br></div></=
div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, A=
pr 13, 2014 at 12:32 PM, Ilmen <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ilme=
n.pokebip@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com</a>&gt;</spa=
n> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
 =20

   =20
 =20
  <div bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF" text=3D"#000000">
    coi ro do<br>
    <br>
    The gismu {vamji} seems to be a promising word for translating &quot;to
    be worth doing&quot;, as well as words such as &quot;recommendable&quot=
;,
    &quot;admirable&quot;, &quot;unacceptable&quot;, &quot;reprehensible/bl=
ameworthy&quot;, etc. (The
    -able/-ible suffix has several different meanings depending on the
    word it attaches to; most often it is {cumki} (-cu&#39;i), but in the
    case of some words like these, {vamji} seems to be the adequate
    word.)<br>
    <br>
    However, I can&#39;t make sense of {vamji}&#39;s argument structure:<br=
>
    <br>
    <table style=3D"border:solid 1px black;background-color:#aabbff" cellpa=
dding=3D"2" cellspacing=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
      <tbody>
        <tr>
          <td valign=3D"top">vamji (value)<br>
            =E2=80=94 x1 (ni) is the equivalent value/worth of x2 [item(s) =
of
            value] to x3 for use/appreciation x4<br>
            =E2=80=94 [also: x2 is worth x1 to x3; (for x2 person:) x2 meri=
ts
            (one sense), (adjective:) x2 is worthy (=3D selva&#39;i for
            reordered places); merit reward (=3D nemselva&#39;i); receive
            merited reward (=3D vamselne&#39;u); x2 may be a specific objec=
t,
            a commodity (mass), an event, or a property; pedantically,
            for objects/commodities, this is sumti-raising from
            ownership of the object/commodity (=3D posyva&#39;i, posyselva&=
#39;i
            for unambiguous semantics)];<br>
            (cf. jdima, jerna, vecnu, dirba, janta, kargu, pleji; see
            note at jdima on cost/price/value distinction, vajni)<br>
          </td>
        </tr>
      </tbody>
    </table>
    <br>
    <br>
    Corpus usage of the arguments of {vamji} =E2=80=94with more than one
    argument place filled=E2=80=94 is scarce, and didn&#39;t help me much.<=
br>
    <br>
    Could somebody enlighten me by providing a couple of example
    sentences using all of {vamji}&#39;s argument places? (Preferably not
    for monetary value usages, as {jdima} is a better word for that
    purpose.)<br>
    <br>
    For example, how would you translate =C2=ABThe film is well worth
    seeing.=C2=BB in Lojban?<br>
    <br>
    Thank you in advance,<br>
    mi&#39;e la .ilmen. mu&#39;o<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#8888=
88"><br>
    <br>
    <br>
  </font></span></div><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888">


<p></p>

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</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div>

<p></p>

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