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Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2014 18:57:47 -0300
Message-ID: <CAO7tK2c2TxDMB-qB-a6eZ0coNTzPdnCgNR4f=Wr1nP67vYrQLw@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] the future of Lojban's leadership
From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jorge_Llamb=C3=ADas?= <jjllambias@gmail.com>
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On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 6:24 PM, Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder -
LLG <lojbab@lojban.org> wrote:

>
>  I am pretty sure that I would misuse xorlo, if only because I don't know
> when NOT to use "lo".


It's very easy: always use "lo", you never have to use any other gadri.

 I believe And may be thinking of something like "mi nelci le nu limna"
>> for "I like swimming". The problem with "le" here is that when you say
>> "I like swimming" you don't have a particular event of swimming in mind,
>> so why would you use "le"?
>>
>
> le is not necessarily singular (or plural), but I certainly have some
> concept of what events of swimming (that I am fond of) are, and I am,
> referring to one or more of such events.


With CLL-le you were saying that you like each one of them, right. but the
point is that that's not what "I like swimming" means.

Perhaps it's even more clear in the negative: compare  "mi na nelci le nu
limna" vs "I don't like swimming".


>  "le nu limna" is supposed to be a particular
>
>> event of swimming that the speaker has in mind.
>>
>> (Nowadays many people would probably rather say "mi nelci lo ka limna",
>> but the change from "nu" to "ka" is not from xorlo.)
>>
>
> But of course I don't know that my concept of swimming and/or its
> properties is the same as yours.  Since I still associate "lo" with
> veridicality, and there are likely some events of swimming that I would not
> nelci, I would have trouble saying "lo".


You can use "le" if you think that's important. xorlo didn't touch
veridicality, it just dropped the hidden quantifiers.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">=
On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 6:24 PM, Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - L=
LG <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lojbab@lojban.org" target=3D"_bl=
ank">lojbab@lojban.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_=
quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1=
ex"><br>=C2=A0I am pretty sure that I would misuse xorlo, if only because I=
 don&#39;t know when NOT to use &quot;lo&quot;.</blockquote><div><br></div>=
<div>It&#39;s very easy: always use &quot;lo&quot;, you never have to use a=
ny other gadri.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
 style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><s=
pan class=3D"">
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
I believe And may be thinking of something like &quot;mi nelci le nu limna&=
quot;<br>
for &quot;I like swimming&quot;. The problem with &quot;le&quot; here is th=
at when you say<br>
&quot;I like swimming&quot; you don&#39;t have a particular event of swimmi=
ng in mind,<br>
so why would you use &quot;le&quot;?<br>
</blockquote>
<br></span>
le is not necessarily singular (or plural), but I certainly have some conce=
pt of what events of swimming (that I am fond of) are, and I am, referring =
to one or more of such events.</blockquote><div><br></div><div>With CLL-le =
you were saying that you like each one of them, right. but the point is tha=
t that&#39;s not what &quot;I like swimming&quot; means.</div><div><br></di=
v><div>Perhaps it&#39;s even more clear in the negative: compare =C2=A0&quo=
t;mi na nelci le nu limna&quot; vs &quot;I don&#39;t like swimming&quot;. =
=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi=
n:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=3D"">
<br>
=C2=A0&quot;le nu limna&quot; is supposed to be a particular<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
event of swimming that the speaker has in mind.<br>
<br>
(Nowadays many people would probably rather say &quot;mi nelci lo ka limna&=
quot;,<br>
but the change from &quot;nu&quot; to &quot;ka&quot; is not from xorlo.)<br=
>
</blockquote>
<br></span>
But of course I don&#39;t know that my concept of swimming and/or its prope=
rties is the same as yours.=C2=A0 Since I still associate &quot;lo&quot; wi=
th veridicality, and there are likely some events of swimming that I would =
not nelci, I would have trouble saying &quot;lo&quot;.</blockquote><div><br=
></div><div>You can use &quot;le&quot; if you think that&#39;s important. x=
orlo didn&#39;t touch veridicality, it just dropped the hidden quantifiers.=
</div><div><br></div><div>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e xorxes</div><div>=C2=A0</div></=
div></div></div>

<p></p>

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