Received: from mail-vc0-f189.google.com ([209.85.220.189]:46263) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1XTupm-0002v6-E3 for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 08:38:29 -0700 Received: by mail-vc0-f189.google.com with SMTP id la4sf5651vcb.6 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 08:38:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject:mime-version :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=ZZKCHDDqXcINuwJxszEo9P2x/V2GX/6kPkMeyVKo574=; b=j+8c/CV0OzPpdNrkr4zfUcWVLdQRzniLiB0mBMs0/gF8PKOskyZs8LIS5YsPwu7R8j 9RL20cPBuP/Kbej4L5fzdAOOUS7fHgYD4u0AZrdkzf38ZuzDHTl4ouHjCIl6mT0jNiyr 6vc1VAuJO0ypXz3Y0WJLZgYAZX5R+njpoGhg067izk9ZeDg8NeNK+wVf932zfuUDWMvn ltsATJMmNwEUHVgGGnKJjO6nZz0qn813WJbg2LNkCvU4Ogj8i18rZTrLo2vLnEXi1YvG 3wXcqLkOiqvjh68Cjs9HzyCN9XBdFnWRmt2c+xq02dKrgmgKONOdd36nHfATVTGQvth9 B3lA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject:mime-version :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=ZZKCHDDqXcINuwJxszEo9P2x/V2GX/6kPkMeyVKo574=; b=uArLI9Hm3TkOebEEdq9IZlgGI8uNTKeIfUnqjU4svEA1ExQoH4O7xIs29YdzIs7HnO rQo0ZE6oCi6VJy56eI6tpcOHnyJ2RCFOS8pO7U4o/qIVhva6PPaZ4z3KZLeds15pW3it fP681U5yidyDr0Fk+85NdOgTQyIxonPp3yr9XFOka/wUUvmvgPuGxybYFqdDPDJUqiVv ulXb3CCfsRSjDe59bndeuQBDG8xHoRZLUY4BEMmZZ9OAIGn3QCdV18kiu2R6RwBjy+Xv jnAodwwtSeHyQudJhQ/pjVYP2Ntyg0i0UH2kZ83j1Hr8QS9lKggiBmpqQlyYpXAF4S+p MVHA== X-Received: by 10.140.101.16 with SMTP id t16mr15045qge.36.1410881899870; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 08:38:19 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.140.43.67 with SMTP id d61ls2147688qga.94.gmail; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 08:38:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.140.41.112 with SMTP id y103mr55431qgy.7.1410881899496; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 08:38:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2014 08:38:18 -0700 (PDT) From: mukti To: lojban@googlegroups.com Message-Id: <863e6344-9008-44be-8546-eed800c0a630@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: References: <5ebfd7de-df4d-4bac-90e9-08d182557c8c@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: [lojban] Growth and decline in lojbanistan MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: shunpiker@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_142_71313219.1410881898583" X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - ------=_Part_142_71313219.1410881898583 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > On Tuesday, September 16, 2014 10:21:33 AM UTC-3, xorxes wrote: > >> Do we have any comparable historical statistics on the lojban irc >> channels activity? My impression is that the decline in list activity is >> due at least in part to a shift from the lists to irc, but I'm not on irc >> very often so I can't really say if that's been declining as well or not. >> > Interesting question. I plotted IRC activity alongside mailing list activity, attached below. I only have data from 2003: The vreji bot began recording lojban utterances in IRC in December 2002. I see that the the "lojban timeline " notes "a serious and growing amount of spontaneous communication in Lojban over IRC" as early as 1997. The level of IRC activity seems to have been relatively flat between 2003 and 2004, but mriste traffic dropped about 40% that year. IRC activity doesn't really take off until after 2006, and the mriste started to recover after 2007. Since that time, they've both shown an overall positive trend, but fell together in 2011 and 2013. Based only on these observations, it seems to be more the case that IRC and mriste activity rise and fall together. But perhaps those who participated in the mriste during the early 2000s can speak to whether their own activity shifted away from the mriste and to IRC. *pc*, seems to have been the most active during this period, with more than 900 messages in 2001, and about 850 in 2002. After 2002, his activity dropped sharply and in 2007 he posted fewer than 100 messages. *xorxes*, you seem to have been the next most active poster during that period, with almost 800 messages in 2001, also dropping sharply after 2002, and falling below 100 in 2007. Message counts for *lojbab* and *And* seem to follow a similar pattern, recording about 400-500 messages in 2001, and then falling below 100 after 2003. The only user I have tracked during this period who does not show this pattern is *gejyspa*, who posted a steady 250-275 messages from 2002-2004, and whose output actually peaked in 2006 with more than 400 messages. Like the others, however, he fell below 100 messages in 2007. I have been attributing the drop-off in the 2003 mriste -- taken together with the other positive indicators that year -- to the introduction of the BPFK phpBB forum. However, it's worth noting that the forum was retired by the end of that year, and activity did not return to the mriste in 2004. It's certainly possible to argue that the decline began in 2003. The continuance of peak membership in 2004 somewhat obscurs the fact that fewer than half of LLG members attended the 2004 annual meeting , and quorum was only possible via proxies. mi'e la mukti mu'o *Notes:* *list posts* includes the "lojban", "jboske", "lojban-beginners" and "bpfk" lists. For *irc activity*, I'm using the number of lojban utterances in korpora zei sisku , and dividing by 100 in order to be able to compare movement of that number with the number of list posts. For (LLG) *members* and *LLG actions*, I multiplied by 100. *LLG actions* only includes non-procedural actions, and does not include votes on projects in 2003. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. ------=_Part_142_71313219.1410881898583 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On T= uesday, September 16, 2014 10:21:33 AM UTC-3, xorxes wrote:
D= o we have any comparable historical statistics on the lojban irc channels a= ctivity? My impression is that the decline in list activity is due at least= in part to a shift from the lists to irc, but I'm not on irc very often so= I can't really say if that's been declining as well or not.

Interesting question.

=
I plotted IRC activity alongside mailing list activity, attached below= . I only have data from 2003: The vreji bot began recording lojban utteranc= es in IRC in December 2002. I see that the the "lojban timeline" notes "a serio= us and growing amount of spontaneous communication in Lojban over IRC" as e= arly as 1997.

The level of IRC activity seems to have be= en relatively flat between 2003 and 2004, but mriste traffic dropped about = 40% that year. IRC activity doesn't really take off until after 2006, and t= he mriste started to recover after 2007. Since that time, they've both show= n an overall positive trend, but fell together in 2011 and 2013.
=
Based only on these observations, it seems to be more the ca= se that IRC and mriste activity rise and fall together. But perhaps those w= ho participated in the mriste during the early 2000s can speak to whether t= heir own activity shifted away from the mriste and to IRC.
<= br>pc, seems to have been the most active during this period, with m= ore than 900 messages in 2001, and about 850 in 2002. After 2002, his activ= ity dropped sharply and in 2007 he posted fewer than 100 messages.
=
xorxes, you seem to have been the next most active poster during= that period, with almost 800 messages in 2001, also dropping sharply after= 2002, and falling below 100 in 2007.

Message counts for lojbab and And seem to follow a similar pattern, recording about 400-500= messages in 2001, and then falling below 100 after 2003.

The only u= ser I have tracked during this period who does not show this pattern is = gejyspa, who posted a steady 250-275 messages from 2002-2004, and whose= output actually peaked in 2006 with more than 400 messages. Like the other= s, however, he fell below 100 messages in 2007.

<= div>I have been attributing the drop-off in the 2003 mriste -- taken togeth= er with the other positive indicators that year -- to the introduction of t= he BPFK phpBB forum. However, it's worth noting that the forum was retired = by the end of that year, and activity did not return to the mriste in 2004.= It's certainly possible to argue that the decline began in 2003. The conti= nuance of peak membership in 2004 somewhat obscurs the fact that fewer than= half of LLG members attended the 2004 annual= meeting, and quorum was only possible via proxies.

mi'e la mukti mu'o

<= /p>

Notes: list posts includes the "l= ojban", "jboske", "lojban-beginners" and "bpfk" lists. For irc activity<= /b>, I'm using the number of lojban utterances in korpora zei sisku, and dividing by 100 in order= to be able to compare movement of that number with the number of list post= s. For (LLG) members and LLG actions, I multiplied by 100. LLG actions only includes non-procedural actions, and does not in= clude votes on projects in 2003.

--
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To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsub= scribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http:= //groups.google.com/group/lojban.
For more options, visit http= s://groups.google.com/d/optout.
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