Received: from mail-ee0-f63.google.com ([74.125.83.63]:38494) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1XTw2L-0003TK-DV for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:31 -0700 Received: by mail-ee0-f63.google.com with SMTP id e49sf41334eek.28 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=6Pr3oCcfELkvjiNSRaFPYeks2nJKhbqhBXr9qKdkKEQ=; b=ZlMGupOIETEa8UEC4MkRQ2VAt+cyIj+2CbXV5D1EkDl+7fnTSRen+zc3AlmTzwTjpH oNKAcOCvyVCSqXENYIuO2CLrDTrX95Nu9Z9pgezOSOvIbFPtiWIYpl9S8zf4Sm1c+72P OnjKisl9ihQ1q3o0kPyvDyro9qtPVAEXKgNiT3pfBPo9+t4XuCV8k4egHP2sgeSTEvZL NnJjgIJRf4M/3DGDs3jbQz28OJAcFZ8GbCMIK2a5Wh0AGFv1AX7WAzucN1nQn4N1gvYO KmofO3geccK8xvjLpa+anwn+tXqfb5OAtDI6NAPInYbeWCDA05+tp3Sk0onZrmvtOE7/ nQ7g== X-Received: by 10.152.6.67 with SMTP id y3mr22015lay.15.1410886522182; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:22 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.152.5.73 with SMTP id q9ls23300laq.27.gmail; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.112.151.3 with SMTP id um3mr649654lbb.15.1410886521221; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wg0-x244.google.com (mail-wg0-x244.google.com [2a00:1450:400c:c00::244]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id i6si161906wiy.0.2014.09.16.09.55.21 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:21 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c00::244 as permitted sender) client-ip=2a00:1450:400c:c00::244; Received: by mail-wg0-x244.google.com with SMTP id y10so29245wgg.11 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:21 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.180.14.101 with SMTP id o5mr34991254wic.25.1410886521122; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.194.89.193 with HTTP; Tue, 16 Sep 2014 09:55:20 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <54185FDF.50102@lojban.org> References: <541714B1.9080300@gmail.com> <54185FDF.50102@lojban.org> Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2014 20:55:20 +0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Logos Initiative From: Gleki Arxokuna To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c00::244 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f46d041555fce8f5490503319daf X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - --f46d041555fce8f5490503319daf Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 2014-09-16 20:05 GMT+04:00 Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG < lojbab@lojban.org>: > On 9/16/2014 2:38 AM, Gleki Arxokuna wrote: > >> Xorlo was an unlucky part of Lojban history where the founders like >> Lojbab didnt see it as a change invalidating CLL, and the others didnt >> bother of amending books and the dictionary. >> > > Actually I did, but I was a) greatly outvoted and b) convinced that the > existing gadri system was broken in a way that made it undocumentable to > BPFK standards, by the people who had accepted responsibility for doing so > (i.e. Nick and later Robin as jatnas). > > One of the few reasons for accepting a change to the baseline, was if CLL > was incorrect or self-contradictory. Having something that was > fundamentally broken was another plausible reason. The active people on > the byfy were overwhelmingly convinced that this was the case for gadri, > and the really tough question was as to what was the minimal change needed > to fix things. > ke'u being good for the design of the language is not necessarily good for the attractiveness of the language if those changes are not put to paper. And they haven't been. > lojbab > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --f46d041555fce8f5490503319daf Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


2014-09-16 20:05 GMT+04:00 Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG= <lojbab@lojban.org>:
On 9/16/2014 2:38 AM, Gleki Arxokuna wrote:
Xorlo was an unlucky part of Lojban history where the founders like
Lojbab didnt see it as a change invalidating CLL, and the others didnt
bother of amending books and the dictionary.

Actually I did, but I was a) greatly outvoted and b) convinced that the exi= sting gadri system was broken in a way that made it undocumentable to BPFK = standards, by the people who had accepted responsibility for doing so (i.e.= Nick and later Robin as jatnas).

One of the few reasons for accepting a change to the baseline, was if CLL w= as incorrect or self-contradictory.=C2=A0 Having something that was fundame= ntally broken was another plausible reason.=C2=A0 The active people on the = byfy were overwhelmingly convinced that this was the case for gadri, and th= e really tough question was as to what was the minimal change needed to fix= things.

ke'u being good for the de= sign of the language is not necessarily good for the attractiveness of the = language if those changes are not put to paper. And they haven't been.<= /div>


lojbab



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