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Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2014 10:12:44 -0400
From: "Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG" <lojbab@lojban.org>
Organization: The Logical Language Group, Inc.
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Subject: Re: [lojban] Logos Initiative
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On 9/16/2014 4:55 PM, TR NS wrote:
> On Tuesday, September 16, 2014 1:29:34 PM UTC-4, lojbab wrote:
>
>
>     No. CLL 1.1 is NOT intended to sit around for a decade, but to serve as
>     the basis for discussing the proposals that people want considered.  If
>     those proposals are well-documented, I could imagine CLL 1.1 be
>     replaced
>     by CLL 2.0 within a couple of years at most.
>
>
> I wonder how you can say that. Didn't you say much the same thing 12
> years ago?

The key clause there is "If those proposals are well-documented".  The 
12 years has been because we have been trying to add documentation that 
did not exist before, and indeed to answer questions that had not been 
asked before, (and the original CLL was not designed to be editable in 
the desired way, which Robin is taking care of now).

If the proposals are documented, to include proposed change pages to 
CLL, then pretty much as soon as a decision is made, the change can be 
incorporated into CLL, essentially immediately.  (Most likely we would 
try to decide most or all issues before incorporating, but that should 
be relatively quick as well.)

> And he we are still waiting for a dictionary?

The dictionary remains a problem, unless someone comes up with something 
publishable out of jbovlaste.  However, I suspect that when the current 
byfy work is done, key people will feel more able and willing to tackle 
that task.

(I should note that my original goal/concept for a dictionary is 
considerably different from what has evolved in jbovlaste, but since I 
am not doing the work, I don't expect to have much say.)

> It seems like a
> very unrealistic expectation. Of course, if you're simply planning to
> rubber stamp 1.1 as 2.0 with a few minor adjustments then I guess it
> could be true.

I don't know what-all changes have been proposed, since I went out of my 
way to ignore them for the last several years.

>     Probably true.  It's also likely that such an effort would not be
>     considered enough like Loglan/Lojban to warrant calling them a
>     "derivation".  English is after all a derivation of Indo-European, and
>     more recently Old English, but relatively few people care to learn
>     anything about those predecessors.
>
> It's all a matter of degree and you can draw the line where you like, of
> course. One could also argue the same about Lojban vs Loglan since the
> vocabularies are completely different.

Lojban isn't a derivation of Loglan.  Lojban IS Loglan, by decree of the 
LLG membership about 20 years ago %^).  But the TLI people never 
completely went away, and thus presumably contest the claim.

> Btw, did you hear that Loglan got rid of `x`?

I am subscribed to the TLI Loglan list, but seldom read the substance. 
I have some interaction with the President of TLI, but we don't talk 
about changes.

Unfortunately, they have the same problem we do: they can vote for such 
a change to their language, but until the change is published in a new 
edition of Loglan 1, most of their audience won't know of such changes, 
much less accept them.

lojbab

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