Received: from mail-ee0-f62.google.com ([74.125.83.62]:51245) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1XYkn6-0006TQ-VL for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Mon, 29 Sep 2014 16:55:45 -0700 Received: by mail-ee0-f62.google.com with SMTP id b57sf1317228eek.7 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2014 16:55:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=46b+UfpHJxjmhFoGD6h2+TbUOLhtKyAAB7mIMnrR1ws=; b=RNcR8io6+rujmWXNSLf4tIMqQvwuQ5b3PQR2boAC07ngJoeUEuEy3lwL21Qiow8b1N BBDu144w1N3jIf0lKXs6JbY7KaTnZFs/tGOZwXXRkF9+VJZ4q0RpdS0M1MNPm8aw/iMk X0EUgOO+uaZ8GwurBp2e9wTa+ir+G3c6vmau1SHEFMcGpI9hx+CE5o+cNqjYbL4/Quvq FqlKtNsNEHt7TRH1IjqMEIthDYI/pSP5mBEArBjK7aBxFVaz/TW36tLwX2Cex36Csm8R 7npWCVBpnsfdit35oDtMldK9e0GDdEylZ1ErQybVZV0TqU+vCj+0ktStpuorRG+HR15a CnMg== X-Received: by 10.181.13.42 with SMTP id ev10mr9945wid.6.1412034934044; Mon, 29 Sep 2014 16:55:34 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.180.183.105 with SMTP id el9ls570540wic.43.canary; Mon, 29 Sep 2014 16:55:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.194.100.3 with SMTP id eu3mr16081wjb.6.1412034933541; Mon, 29 Sep 2014 16:55:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net. [212.227.17.22]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id us10si1083188lbc.1.2014.09.29.16.55.33 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Sep 2014 16:55:33 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.17.22 as permitted sender) client-ip=212.227.17.22; Received: from [192.168.2.118] ([93.220.110.80]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx103) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MI5rO-1XYDco48XG-003sKU for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 01:55:33 +0200 Message-ID: <5429F175.40000@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 01:55:33 +0200 From: selpa'i User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Speaker specificity: {.i da'i na vajni} References: <5427DCE6.9020900@gmx.de> <4004291.GPfs8n1fLZ@caracal> <54295019.6010707@gmx.de> <54298F49.8000708@gmail.com> <5429A27F.1040906@gmx.de> <5447269e-70a3-4825-9d3d-40b7a9e24876@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: <5447269e-70a3-4825-9d3d-40b7a9e24876@googlegroups.com> X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:RetU0RlUEWGHXx+fRJzwIN5cp4mQlRMNw22SAYgNUBPbXf/KE2X BoVzq7WQmBcPFdX8s7IK05+IeIf6LmODdOh1oEEYrcqk99516860lvbpte7s932P1AHRXhr vtMde0HM5dCqJgFpdvNYw41oWMhpMFnCFr024nxaoBWnG3M85V7vZMOcU4HeKaCzT8IASm3 waOBGCnsLuj4HJy8+d/Ug== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1; X-Original-Sender: seladwa@gmx.de X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.17.22 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=seladwa@gmx.de Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - la .trans. cu cusku di'e > I would very much like to read Loglan 2 Chapter 8 to learn more, but I > have to find a copy of Loglan 2. In any case, my take away from this is > that the definition of le is essentially: > > =E2=88=83X: P(X) and if =E2=88=83Y: P(Y) then Y=3DX, with the proviso C(X= ) & C(Y). > > P is the descriptive predicate and C means "is within the context of > conversation". I am inclined to think that this last part is the the > missing logic that could tie Russell's thinking in with JCBs. This is more or less what I suggested, but your formula does not account=20 for plurals (though you did use capital letters for your variables). To=20 make it work for plurals, you need to use plural variables and replace=20 the identity relation with the among relation in your formula. In any case, if that is what {le} means, then how does it differ from=20 {lo}, for which the same definition would also make sense? mi'e la selpa'i mu'o --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.