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Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:00:43 -0300
Message-ID: <CAO7tK2c8mErNhpYNRrxW3q967rfXEYZad+K6JD-iPp0pt2=1gA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] Speaker specificity: {.i da'i na vajni}
From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jorge_Llamb=C3=ADas?= <jjllambias@gmail.com>
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On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 7:35 AM, selpa'i <seladwa@gmx.de> wrote:

>
> Although, if {le} is defined as a name, then the other definition I showed
> is available to define {lo}. Then there would at least be a much clearer
> difference between the two gadri.


The reason a Russell type quantifier is not quite right for "lo" is that we
don't want "naku lo broda cu brode" to be true just because there are no
brodas. The Frege/Strawson analysis is more in line with "lo", I think:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definite_description

That's the reason for "noi" in the definition, we don't want the
description to share the illocutionary force of the claim, it has to be a
presupposition or something like that.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te">On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 7:35 AM, selpa&#39;i <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:seladwa@gmx.de" target=3D"_blank">seladwa@gmx.de</a>&gt;</spa=
n> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px =
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-=
style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=3D""><br></span>
Although, if {le} is defined as a name, then the other definition I showed =
is available to define {lo}. Then there would at least be a much clearer di=
fference between the two gadri.=C2=A0</blockquote><div><br></div><div>The r=
eason a Russell type quantifier is not quite right for &quot;lo&quot; is th=
at we don&#39;t want &quot;naku lo broda cu brode&quot; to be true just bec=
ause there are no brodas. The Frege/Strawson analysis is more in line with =
&quot;lo&quot;, I think: <a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definite_d=
escription">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definite_description</a></div><div=
><br></div><div>That&#39;s the reason for &quot;noi&quot; in the definition=
, we don&#39;t want the description to share the illocutionary force of the=
 claim, it has to be a presupposition or something like that.=C2=A0</div><d=
iv><br></div><div>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e xorxes</div><div><br></div></div></div>=
</div>

<p></p>

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