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Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: tersmu 0.2
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From: "'John E. Clifford' via lojban" <lojban@googlegroups.com>
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Message-Id: <ADD94FE3-2B8C-42C7-87EE-4B81F2BB26C0@yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2014 10:07:35 -0500
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Sorry I got the wrong reading.  I have to take your word that the "Lojban" =
says something else, since it is quite unintelligible.

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 11, 2014, at 9:20, Jorge Llamb=C3=ADas <jjllambias@gmail.com> wrote:

>=20
>=20
> On Sat, Oct 11, 2014 at 9:39 AM, 'John E. Clifford' via lojban <lojban@go=
oglegroups.com> wrote:
>=20
> I got to wondering about "What I think John knows is possible", ignoring =
the extra problems of cognitive predicates and using / for the descriptor, =
since typefaces keep confusing LC ell with one and uc i. P /x(Bi/y(^Kjx^y))=
, which Is not going to convert easily, as you say.
>=20
> Actually, the English is ambiguous, but my example was just a referring t=
erm, not a complete formula:  /x(Bi/y(^Kj/z(^Px^z)^y)  if I understand the =
notation correctly. I suppose you just read the English and not the Lojban =
forms, which didn't share that ambiguity:
>=20
>   lo poi'i mi jinvi lo du'u la djan cu djuno lo du'u ke'a cumki
>   xxx poi mi jinvi lo du'u la djan cu djuno lo du'u ke'a cumki
>   zo'e noi mi jinvi lo du'u la djan cu djuno lo du'u ke'a cumki
>=20
> =20
>  But that is no reason to disparage cases that do convert easily. =20
>=20
>  We're not disparaging the more ergonomic forms, they are used all the ti=
me.=20
>=20
> Indeed, it makes me inclined to doubt the legitimacy of the form itself (=
quantifying in and all that).
>=20
> What would it mean that it was illegitimate? It wouldn't mean anything, o=
r it would mean something else?
>=20
> mu'o mi'e xorxes
>=20
> --=20
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 "lojban" group.
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<html><head></head><body bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div>Sorry I got the wrong rea=
ding. &nbsp;I have to take your word that the "Lojban" says something else,=
 since it is quite unintelligible.<br><br>Sent from my iPad</div><div><br>O=
n Oct 11, 2014, at 9:20, Jorge Llamb=C3=ADas &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jjllambi=
as@gmail.com">jjllambias@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><=
blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extr=
a"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Oct 11, 2014 at 9:39 AM, 'John E.=
 Clifford' via lojban <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lojban@google=
groups.com" target=3D"_blank">lojban@googlegroups.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:=
<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;bor=
der-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:sol=
id;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div><br></div><div><span>I g=
ot to wondering about "What I think John knows is possible", ignoring the e=
xtra problems of cognitive predicates and using / for the descriptor, since=
 typefaces keep confusing LC ell with one and uc i. P /x(Bi/y(^Kjx^y)), whi=
ch Is not going to convert easily, as you say. </span></div></div></blockqu=
ote><div><br></div><div>Actually, the English is ambiguous, but my example =
was just a referring term, not a complete formula: &nbsp;/x(Bi/y(^Kj/z(^Px^=
z)^y) &nbsp;if I understand the notation correctly. I suppose you just read=
 the English and not the Lojban forms, which didn't share that ambiguity:</=
div><div><br></div><div><div style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-siz=
e:13px">&nbsp; lo poi'i mi jinvi lo du'u la djan cu djuno lo du'u ke'a cumk=
i</div><div style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">&nbsp; xx=
x poi mi jinvi lo du'u la djan cu djuno lo du'u ke'a cumki<br></div><div st=
yle=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">&nbsp; zo'e noi mi jinv=
i lo du'u la djan cu djuno lo du'u ke'a cumki</div></div><div><br></div><di=
v>&nbsp;</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px=
 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left=
-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div><span>&nbsp;Bu=
t that is no reason to disparage cases that do convert easily. &nbsp;</span=
></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>&nbsp;We're not disparaging t=
he more ergonomic forms, they are used all the time.&nbsp;</div><div><br></=
div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;bor=
der-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:sol=
id;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div><span>Indeed, it makes m=
e inclined to doubt the legitimacy of the form itself (quantifying in and a=
ll that).</span></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>What would it =
mean that it was illegitimate? It wouldn't mean anything, or it would mean =
something else?</div><div><br></div><div>mu'o mi'e xorxes</div><div><br></d=
iv></div></div></div>

<p></p>

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</div></blockquote></body></html>

<p></p>

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