Received: from mail-wi0-f186.google.com ([209.85.212.186]:49308) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1XigqN-0001O7-LY for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Mon, 27 Oct 2014 02:44:12 -0700 Received: by mail-wi0-f186.google.com with SMTP id ex7sf417739wid.23 for ; Mon, 27 Oct 2014 02:44:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=kAVdPR1HzGNmBr/I0+gbLFPYzaBIRd8nCBuLs35fKOA=; b=vQ1phT5Zkf5rkfKbhfGCwD+Jwo2xSoXCaS9aYdrccNfqCvU9JhHAo+XEfryxXsYDfX 49SGK2eH00mcrS4Hnmie4loL4GeNRPGrvZJLsEabDRjabkYtVQ2WlfGTjw5e+2BLJO2p oywhtFIOxl4va9Vr2gxlW62HW9/0onsJfns9HfBAbWY7Bgz8axvIKaVI/En7GvW1qEdu JgRNBhikzbVk/OO0vVoaiQjx8LusSdKYBo0JV5jfJQTz5f2vs5BsrXPHdps8qq0BxyuD jkv4PIjZD+Dc4foTxcBURxStePQ+9wv2u7hJ4l+q6NTjOZ5eeMk32uZddxF2tMB4FFus JcxQ== X-Received: by 10.152.234.44 with SMTP id ub12mr11607lac.14.1414403040030; Mon, 27 Oct 2014 02:44:00 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.152.4.225 with SMTP id n1ls654747lan.34.gmail; Mon, 27 Oct 2014 02:43:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.112.55.10 with SMTP id n10mr219854lbp.14.1414403038945; Mon, 27 Oct 2014 02:43:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net. [212.227.15.15]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id us10si1557688lbc.1.2014.10.27.02.43.58 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 27 Oct 2014 02:43:58 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.15.15 as permitted sender) client-ip=212.227.15.15; Received: from [192.168.2.118] ([93.220.86.9]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0M92ZJ-1XoVjn1aqD-00COw7 for ; Mon, 27 Oct 2014 10:43:58 +0100 Message-ID: <544E13DF.8070207@gmx.de> Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2014 10:43:59 +0100 From: selpa'i User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Lojban's Biggest Problem or Why Still Nobody Speaks It References: <544D34B1.7000000@gmx.de> <20141026183320.GD13145@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> In-Reply-To: <20141026183320.GD13145@stodi.digitalkingdom.org> X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:hc5UM4FDChUJM1CI7x4oNy6OeZ+aUYFHIjXu2swnow5sKGyj2H6 DS7aAJEkm1dcM6XwQpXbn5N/m7NBWXfybxp9Mh8UeIhGK9vU5CVnf9IUB7I19ysS0KWA8ip c1LOdM9GCT0kLQcR0AO1zl3ysVmnNZeiChs0vni0Wt461GW/+vPcDtJE7rHjQrEYT3C/3Jk FpFFNJLmuICDR9XvjJUBg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1; X-Original-Sender: seladwa@gmx.de X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.15.15 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=seladwa@gmx.de Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - la .camgusmis. cu cusku di'e > On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 06:51:45PM +0100, selpa'i wrote: >> Simply put, there aren't enough words, and the few words that >> exist do not enable us to make nuanced descriptions of the world. > > I would say it's a mixture of lack of words and lack of phrasal > idiom. > > Frankly, though, I consider the self-similarity of existing words, > and the vast array of accidental tongue twisters, to be more serious > problems than the lack of vocab. The language is *physically* hard > to speak, to an extent that is distinctly unpleasent. I have certainly come across phrases that are difficult to pronounce quickly, though it has gotten much easier for me (as a rapper I'm forced to learn to say things quickly). Logically speaking, however, I would say that not having any words is infinitely worse than having words that are hard to pronounce or that cause tongue twisters now and then, since in one case you can say what you mean (even if you may have to slow down in places to keep your tongue from twisting) and in the other you can't no matter how hard your tongue tries. mi'e la selpa'i mu'o -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.