Received: from mail-wi0-f185.google.com ([209.85.212.185]:46381) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1XqfvI-0006DV-F8 for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:14 -0800 Received: by mail-wi0-f185.google.com with SMTP id ex7sf612189wid.12 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=aMo6Z+2ji+lh9iLoh0gBxbkk5GUfVz1kQd5rRq2Pmz8=; b=ES/OEiL/ztUfnwD11LU4mNkVFP39M5vG2NgrFSKJZ3K70fd/Fm+unSgB826Tlw7wHy ri2oTUKAtKdItuyfzAzLWCCZVWdsWlxr/wefvfuhwUdhCFMNSA6REgq8sSCi51KBpzic Mhfiw0UWA3xtba02ATGpUxr+dmrciSvYn/hde0vKzDD9VeOZ6lNpEmL6kOJpR16Wj3CF /dvtZTgPvHGmSnmmgvfIu9XE36YdJnYSoD+qsM5jXyPKyiIuTCTTie5GxShAjDt400Kv fbIYlbPayZV1tfb88fMJSJPde99se9GatCrdWjZTuo200/5leeoYSlGdIgaVLPXfmeCR 8HAg== X-Received: by 10.152.28.165 with SMTP id c5mr1186792lah.2.1416306125386; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:05 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.152.36.201 with SMTP id s9ls972213laj.100.gmail; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:04 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.112.147.131 with SMTP id tk3mr8758604lbb.2.1416306124354; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wg0-x236.google.com (mail-wg0-x236.google.com. [2a00:1450:400c:c00::236]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id el8si775878wib.3.2014.11.18.02.22.04 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:04 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c00::236 as permitted sender) client-ip=2a00:1450:400c:c00::236; Received: by mail-wg0-f54.google.com with SMTP id y10so5757699wgg.41 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.180.187.234 with SMTP id fv10mr39236828wic.25.1416306124229; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.194.103.65 with HTTP; Tue, 18 Nov 2014 02:22:04 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2014 13:22:04 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: [lojban] {zu'enai}. meaning From: Gleki Arxokuna To: "lojban@googlegroups.com" X-Original-Sender: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c00::236 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c3848e6d946905081f770e X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - --001a11c3848e6d946905081f770e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Accepted by the off. grammar what does {zu'enai} mean? If zukte2 always refers to the action/free will of zukte1 then {zu'e mi viska ko'a} is expanded into {mi zukte lo nu mi viska ko'a}. Okay, if this is fine then we have {zu'e mi viska ko'a} = I intentionally (via a free will) see ko'a. It's somewhat similar to "I watch" but not in the sense of {catlu} which is more about "to look (ptobably, not limited to vision)". However, the antonym of {zukte lo ka viska} is something like "to catch the eye/eye-catching". {zu'enai mi viska ko'a} = Something caught my eye. Is it really so? Because if {zu'enai} = {fi'o na zukte} then it expands into {mi na zukte lo ka viska ko'a} which doesn't state whether I saw ko'a or not. May be it should be expanded into {mi na'e zukte lo ka viska}? Then it'd make more sense. Or may be it's magical focus that when being changed putting {viska} to the main clause changes the meaning drastically? Where is my mistake? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --001a11c3848e6d946905081f770e Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Accepted by the off. grammar what does {zu'enai} mean?=

If zukte2 always refers to the action/free will of zukt= e1 then {zu'e mi viska ko'a} is expanded into {mi zukte lo nu mi vi= ska ko'a}.

Okay, if this is fine then we have<= /div>
{zu'e mi viska ko'a} =3D I intentionally (via a free will= ) see ko'a.
It's somewhat similar to "I watch" = but not in the sense of {catlu} which is more about "to look (ptobably= , not limited to vision)".

However, the anton= ym of {zukte lo ka viska} is something like "to catch the eye/eye-catc= hing".
{zu'enai mi viska ko'a} =3D Something caught = my eye.

Is it really so? Because if {zu'enai} = =3D {fi'o na zukte} then it expands into {mi na zukte lo ka viska ko= 9;a} which doesn't state whether I saw ko'a or not.

<= /div>
May be it should be expanded into {mi na'e zukte lo ka viska}= ? Then it'd make more sense.

Or may be it'= s magical focus that when being changed putting {viska} to the main clause = changes the meaning drastically?

Where is my mista= ke?

--
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