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Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2015 15:15:09 +0000
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Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Questions about Lojban
From: And Rosta <and.rosta@gmail.com>
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 Content preview:  On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:44 PM, Pierre Abbat <phma@bezitopo.org>
    wrote: > On Thursday, January 29, 2015 10:25:41 And Rosta wrote: > > No.
   The ambiguity is syntactic. -Ing has no polysemy; it is merely the > > default
    inflectional form of the verb. > > "-ing" is polysemous, though I don't think
    it's relevant to this sentence. > [...] 
 
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On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:44 PM, Pierre Abbat <phma@bezitopo.org> wrote:

> On Thursday, January 29, 2015 10:25:41 And Rosta wrote:
> > No. The ambiguity is syntactic. -Ing has no polysemy; it is merely the
> > default inflectional form of the verb.
>
> "-ing" is polysemous, though I don't think it's relevant to this sentence=
.
>

I agree it's not relevant.

But responding on the not relevant point:


> It's both the present active participle, previously "-ind", cognate to
> German
> "-end", French "-ant" and Greek "-=CF=89=CE=BD"; and the verbal noun, cog=
nate to
> German
> "-ung". "I stopped flying" can be parsed with both meanings of "-ing",
> which
> doesn't change the meaning of the sentence much.
>

Diachronic merger of formerly discrete forms doesn't entail synchronic
polysemy. Even if there is a syntactic difference between participle and
verbal noun (which I dispute, but am in a minority on), that doesn't entail
polysemy, and polysemy isn't evident; but I will concede that to most
observers the participle in progressive constructions does appear to have
distinctive meaning (tho again I think that's a misanalysis, but am in a
tiny minority on). (Also, to be over-pedantic, ascribing polysemy to the
affix itself is probably an unnecessarily strong commitment to a particular
set of assumptions about morphology.)

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">=
On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:44 PM, Pierre Abbat <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:phma@bezitopo.org" target=3D"_blank">phma@bezitopo.org</a>&gt;</=
span> wrote:<br><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:=
1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-st=
yle:solid" class=3D"gmail_quote"><span>On Thursday, January 29, 2015 10:25:=
41 And Rosta wrote:<br>
&gt; No. The ambiguity is syntactic. -Ing has no polysemy; it is merely the=
<br>
&gt; default inflectional form of the verb.<br>
<br>
</span>&quot;-ing&quot; is polysemous, though I don&#39;t think it&#39;s re=
levant to this sentence.<br></blockquote><div>=C2=A0</div><div>I agree it&#=
39;s not relevant.</div><div>=C2=A0</div><div>But responding on the not rel=
evant point:</div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px =
0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width=
:1px;border-left-style:solid" class=3D"gmail_quote">
It&#39;s both the present active participle, previously &quot;-ind&quot;, c=
ognate to German<br>
&quot;-end&quot;, French &quot;-ant&quot; and Greek &quot;-=CF=89=CE=BD&quo=
t;; and the verbal noun, cognate to German<br>
&quot;-ung&quot;. &quot;I stopped flying&quot; can be parsed with both mean=
ings of &quot;-ing&quot;, which<br>
doesn&#39;t change the meaning of the sentence much.<br></blockquote><div>=
=C2=A0</div><div>Diachronic merger of formerly discrete forms doesn&#39;t e=
ntail synchronic polysemy. Even if there is a syntactic difference between =
participle and verbal noun (which I dispute, but am in a minority on), that=
 doesn&#39;t entail polysemy, and polysemy isn&#39;t evident; but I will co=
ncede that to most observers the participle in progressive constructions do=
es appear to have distinctive meaning (tho again I think that&#39;s a misan=
alysis, but am in a tiny minority on). (Also, to be over-pedantic, ascribin=
g polysemy to the affix itself is probably an unnecessarily strong commitme=
nt to a particular set of assumptions about morphology.)</div></div></div><=
/div>

<p></p>

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