Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2015 20:43:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Spheniscine (la zipcpi)" <spheniscine@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
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Subject: [lojban] Re: Lojban pronuncation
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Ah yes, the syllabic consonants. I have two solutions to them; one that 
will (hopefully) allow you to speak Lojban as she is defined, and another 
that is non-standard as of now but shouldn't cause many problems:

1. (official solution) Note that only *sonorants* (r, m, n, l) may be 
syllabic. Why? Because sonorants are special in that you can hold a note 
with them. Try it. Other Lojban consonants are called *obstruents* and 
can't have a note held. Try {b} for example.

Thus, practice holding notes with r/m/n/l, then practice sandwiching them 
between two consonants as if they are a vowel, "cidj-rrrr-spageti", and 
hopefully you'll master them.

2. (non-standard solution) Just mentally add a {y} before the syllabic 
consonant, and pronounce it as {cidjyrspageti}. For all practical purposes, 
this cannot be confused by anything else currently accepted in Lojban 
morphology. 

There are theoretical fu'ivla/zi'evla that *would* be confusable, e.g. 
{xazd,m,ru} would become {xazdymru}, which is a lujvo (xazdo zei mruli), 
but none are actually defined or used. There is a proposal in the works to 
ban zi'evla like {xazdmru} altogether, and allow {cidjyrspageti} to be an 
allowed alternate spelling of {cidjrspageti}

----
Additionally, there are often defined alternatives to zi'evla with syllabic 
sonorants. {cidjrspageti}, for instance, is often just {spageti}.

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Ah yes, the syllabic consonants. I have two solutions to t=
hem; one that will (hopefully) allow you to speak Lojban as she is defined,=
 and another that is non-standard as of now but shouldn&#39;t cause many pr=
oblems:<div><br></div><div>1. (official solution) Note that only <i>sonoran=
ts</i> (r, m, n, l) may be syllabic. Why? Because sonorants are special in =
that you can hold a note with them. Try it. Other Lojban consonants are cal=
led <i>obstruents</i>=C2=A0and can&#39;t have a note held. Try {b} for exam=
ple.</div><div><br></div><div>Thus, practice holding notes with r/m/n/l, th=
en practice sandwiching them between two consonants as if they are a vowel,=
 &quot;cidj-rrrr-spageti&quot;, and hopefully you&#39;ll master them.</div>=
<div><br></div><div>2. (non-standard solution) Just mentally add a {y} befo=
re the syllabic consonant, and pronounce it as {cidjyrspageti}. For all pra=
ctical purposes, this cannot be confused by anything else currently accepte=
d in Lojban morphology.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>There are theoretica=
l fu&#39;ivla/zi&#39;evla that <i>would</i>=C2=A0be confusable, e.g. {xazd,=
m,ru} would become {xazdymru}, which is a lujvo (xazdo zei mruli), but none=
 are actually defined or used. There is a proposal in the works to ban zi&#=
39;evla like {xazdmru} altogether, and allow {cidjyrspageti} to be an allow=
ed alternate spelling of {cidjrspageti}</div><div><br></div><div>----</div>=
<div>Additionally, there are often defined alternatives to zi&#39;evla with=
 syllabic sonorants. {cidjrspageti}, for instance, is often just {spageti}.=
</div></div>

<p></p>

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