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[212.227.15.18]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b4si647437wme.3.2016.01.20.05.03.57 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 20 Jan 2016 05:03:57 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.15.18 as permitted sender) client-ip=212.227.15.18; Received: from [192.168.2.128] ([93.220.124.159]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx001) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LvlTo-1a5Mf23F7c-017WH5 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 14:03:56 +0100 Subject: Re: [lojban] {cukta} as a case study for why the dictionary needs clearer, more detailed entries To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <6f919681-f16c-4888-aa5a-30518a717c12@googlegroups.com> From: selpahi Message-ID: <569F85BF.8030909@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 14:03:59 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6f919681-f16c-4888-aa5a-30518a717c12@googlegroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:TfyswQ9A/+jrkVN0lOM/vnZZRfoBZTUIoRlRUvOE+hddFusVD10 9ChJLgjjm1p+Y5GHNExnOcClsMpptzTqnZ9nkueKV5nkD7FvtLy2HZUKzx9zMVXGgooSMlC 4kyr5KmUxTgRlB0Vj1SGM0mFBD6gum1yXs1LCkPl3H80guANiY87DPUuSVR9wO16XoQNJj9 ENuLHGHeaWJ5Bg2mNRAuw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:4ttjLGVE234=:gTEJJLDKAHmQ/Jm1Wgae4P T43RxmvFrIeVzmouuy2z8WRZVLrxnZfhTgdRAX2pVyRI/55pQV4zPWQqBj3FLWXe5Htbp2P/u 8DeL7d2rsrU0OgqxBXS9PqzX5qG/tPUL3sk6vjiIm45y00ZS3ImH8QRtDPkPb569epxg5Doq7 Zsf10WAoozOvlvZgmljOyjgESbEOk05M3kAlTeV/08QdPRdhKLb83TQ1CqC4ijlfVu2Px0vyN fKB4QsSk2air4XWLdCZQN31B5ULvU3XrmteTe93J/EMpTlvMTK7JXJgK5QzfwB0PoQIWC9ifC QmCJuwTLE+MJAzqP16VQOe9PuPe3zxhcMIGMZkLyat+r2cWWdI47/+cMARV0P1WKFdq4+P7t2 ErU2Mptv7A3RghQdF6yBsnZglTyUTcap5HZHL1faZ+jxu4CVsh47rjKIdg0psQlXwT8/uo+or Z4vDyMmc+jUMgjp3SuXC2BK7eWIGHA6IFnvycb4JeMEXGMNxuBbzFO5R3StsAIQMzfGLIfs5u om14oKvb4FwDnzkKq5MvLTlcRMVqgq50Ko4v/HJTaOjbgOnXLkxdIzHtGwgHy52XB/TAQPagx 5HPPO6iIxn2yt//+6Ogq6IEZxJIhDYOue3qfqrR4E31z48eO+PVTlszC97cQbkiQNYrho3YtZ KeJepLwb335ISjbZQBs4NObQNWtj3Rq2gUoeXdfYWcbasdYh8zESATnkfUTbtFMGvGVIyPlvi 8aGICtjE434BmoaED1tuVB7leSOC5bbuhJn0nuJBBEa5AmCwvNCrD5DESaaVnDSydFKk8lWJs A2Ro1QY X-Original-Sender: seladwa@gmx.de X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of seladwa@gmx.de designates 212.227.15.18 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=seladwa@gmx.de Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Spam-Checked-In-Group: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.7 X-Spam_score_int: -16 X-Spam_bar: - la .cemjig. cu skuna si cusku di'e > More broadly, I think updating the lojban dictionaries in general should > be considered an urgently important task. I agree wholeheartedly, and really, many of us do. (It's quite obvious that the gismu definitions are inadequate if one takes a close look at them!) A while ago a bunch of people attempted to start an effort of reviewing and revising the gismu list; you can read about it here: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/h6yQDGV5lQw/Z4hZeG9rBUEJ (If you read the whole thread you will also see some of the crazier counter-arguments to revising the gismu) The point is, the thing you observed with {cukta} is the same for almost any gismu. So there are two main problems: 1) Many gismu are under-formalized; 2) There are many gismu that violate common patterns. Many of us hope that work on the gismu list will pick up again at some point, but nobody knows when that will be. At least now, compared to two years ago, BPFK has the official backing of LLG to undertake such a thing, so we really only need to ... just do it. mi'e la selpa'i -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.