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[2a00:1450:400c:c09::231]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id q64si286058wmg.0.2016.02.01.05.01.18 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 01 Feb 2016 05:01:18 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c09::231 as permitted sender) client-ip=2a00:1450:400c:c09::231; Received: by mail-wm0-x231.google.com with SMTP id 128so69653430wmz.1 for ; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 05:01:18 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.28.230.92 with SMTP id d89mr12454891wmh.12.1454331678395; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 05:01:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.102] (95-210-220-116.ip.skylogicnet.com. [95.210.220.116]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id ct2sm28985742wjb.46.2016.02.01.05.01.14 for (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Mon, 01 Feb 2016 05:01:17 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <56AF570C.1050409@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2016 14:01:00 +0100 From: Ilmen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?Re=3A_=5Blojban=5D_The_experimental_version_of_Camxes=2DJS_?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=94_=5Bfork_from_the_thread_=22Terminator_for_la=22=5D?= References: <82905720-4d75-4196-9886-cc8c034d9f83@googlegroups.com> <6e9ca8d6-4dcc-4103-a990-4df0ffb16899@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------010106010606060402060003" X-Original-Sender: ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c09::231 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Spam-Checked-In-Group: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.7 X-Spam_score_int: -16 X-Spam_bar: - This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010106010606060402060003 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The experimental Camxes-JS parser=20 I initiated=20 was by no mean intended to represent the official grammar of Lojban or=20 any upgrade thereof; the experimental Camxes is there for testing=20 implementations of various grammar change proposals, in order to check=20 whether they are compatible with PEG or conflict with some other parts=20 of the grammar, a little like a sandbox grammar; some of these changes=20 might be approved to be part of official Lojban in the future, and=20 others are either unlikely to be approved or are highly controversial. The experimental Camxes-JS was thus by no mean intended to be able to=20 parse the story called {la .teris.}. :-) The official version of Camxes-JS=20 should comply=20 with whatever decisions the BPFK makes with regard to the grammar, and=20 be updated accordingly. If you want to parse a text using the official=20 grammar, please use the official version of Camxes-JS, and not the=20 experimental version thereof. As for other common dialects, they'd need their own dedicated parser,=20 and I approve of Guskant's initiative to make Zantufa parsers for=20 several of these dialects (for example the one used in The Wonderful=20 Wizard of Oz, which uses the Brivla-Cmevla Merger). mi'e la .ilmen. mu'o On 01/02/2016 12:21, Gleki Arxokuna wrote: > By camxes experimental it's usually meant > https://github.com/Ilmen-vodhr/ilmentufa/ > > not any other repos. > > So you'd rather express yourself clearly what you mean by "camxes". > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: *guskant* > > Date: 2016-02-01 13:27 GMT+03:00 > Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Terminator for la > To: Lojban Beginners > > > > > > Le lundi 1 f=C3=A9vrier 2016 06:34:25 UTC, la gleki a =C3=A9crit : > > > 2016-01-30 17:42 GMT+03:00 guskant : > > I recommend using camxes for teaching beginners, not the > canxes-experimental that was deteriorated by la gleki. > > > I'm not aware it was deteriorated by me. Can you provide any > explanation? > > > > 1. Your camxes-experimental parser does not parse even {la teris}=20 > written in basic lojban suitable for beginners, either the old version=20 > or the new one. > https://mw.lojban.org/papri/la_.teris._po'u_lo_tirxu_cu_vitke_zi'o_le_bar= da_tcadu=20 > > https://mw.lojban.org/papri/la_.teris._ku_noi_tigra_cu_stuvi'e_lo_barda_t= cadu=20 > > > 2. You said you would not select backward incompatible changes, but=20 > your camxes-experimental parser is incompatible with the official=20 > grammar for cmevla as selbrisle. > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/oriGf4t1_Xc/eSljctvEDAAJ > > 3. You destroyed all the ilmentufa parsers in the first two weeks of=20 > this year by modifying preproc.js. > https://github.com/lagleki/glekitufa/commit/9dbe1756b016ea567d23e2f0b1201= c32bf817a32#commitcomment-15414073 > > > Such a problem may occur again anytime in the future as long as you=20 > continue executing your dictatorship on the lojban.org=20 > server. > > 4. The solutions for the problem 1 and the problem 2 are incompatible,=20 > so you have no way to solve all the problems. > > Don't disturb anymore this thread for the defects of your=20 > camxes-experimental parser. If you have any objection, continue it on=20 > the general lojban list, not on the beginner's list. > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/lojban. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --------------010106010606060402060003 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable T= he experimental Camxes-JS parser I initiated was by no mean intended to represent the official grammar of Lojban or any upgrade thereof; the experimental Camxes is there for testing implementations of various grammar change proposals, in order to check whether they are compatible with PEG or conflict with some other parts of the grammar, a little like a sandbox grammar; some of these changes might be approved to be part of official Lojban in the future, and others are either unlikely to be approved or are highly controversial.

The experimental Camxes-JS was thus by no mean intended to be able to parse the story called {la .teris.}. :-)

The official version of Camxes-JS should comply with whatever decisions the BPFK makes with regard to the grammar, and be updated accordingly. If you want to parse a text using the official grammar, please use the official version of Camxes-JS, and not the experimental version thereof.

As for other common dialects, they'd need their own dedicated parser, and I approve of Guskant's initiative to make Zantufa parsers for several of these dialects (for example the one used in The Wonderful Wizard of Oz, which uses the Brivla-Cmevla Merger).

mi'e la .ilmen. mu'o


On 01/02/2016 12:21, Gleki Arxokuna wrote:
By camxes experimental it's usually meant

not any other repos.

So you'd rather=C2=A0express yourself clearly what you mean by "camxes".


---------- Forwarded message ----------<= br> From: guskant <gusni.kantu@gmail.com>
Date: 2016-02-01 13:27 GMT+03:00
Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Terminator for la
To: Lojban Beginners <lojban-beginn= ers@googlegroups.com>




Le lundi 1 f=C3=A9vrier 2016 06:34:25 UTC, la gleki a =C3=A9cri= t=C2=A0:

2016-01-30 17:42 GMT+03:00 guskant <gusni..= .@gmail.com>:
I recommend using camxes for teaching beginners, not the canxes-experimental that was deteriorated by la gleki.

I'm not aware it was deteriorated by me. Can you provide any explanation?
1. Your camxes-experimental parser does not parse even {la teris} written in basic lojban suitable for beginners, either the old version or the new one.

2. You said you would not select backward incompatible changes, but your camxes-experimental parser is incompatible with the official grammar for cmevla as selbrisle.

3. You destroyed all the ilmentufa parsers in the first two weeks of this year by modifying preproc.js.
https://github.com/lagleki/glekitufa/comm= it/9dbe1756b016ea567d23e2f0b1201c32bf817a32#commitcomment-15414073


Such a problem may occur again anytime in the future as long as you continue executing your dictatorship on the lojban.org server.

4. The solutions for the problem 1 and the problem 2 are incompatible, so you have no way to solve all the problems.=C2=A0

Don't disturb anymore this thread for the defects of your camxes-experimental parser. If you have any objection, continue it on the general lojban list, not on the beginner's list.

--
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