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Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2016 11:00:09 +0000
Message-ID: <CACf3dP=iB6zNszFK2p8pY-tZqNASFj7Pv4OBxFHVV7sX7tN-tg@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] Pronunciation on "The Crash Course"
From: And Rosta <and.rosta@gmail.com>
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On 2 Mar 2016 08:42, "Gleki Arxokuna" <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> 2016-03-02 11:16 GMT+03:00 And Rosta <and.rosta@gmail.com>:
>>
>>
>> On 2 Mar 2016 07:42, "Luke Bergen" <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Found my way to https://mw.lojban.org/papri/The_Crash_Course_(a_draft)
and noticed "ia is pronounced as yu in yummy". Is this true? I thought
given the pronunciation of "a" that "ia" would be pronounced more like "yo"
as in "yonder" or "beyond".
>> >
>> > I'd think if you wanted to make the "yu" as in "yummy" sound in lojban
the closest thing would be "iy"
>> >
>> > Am I wrong in this?
>>
>> You're right for North Americans. The crash course is right for the
Southern English and Southern Hemisphereans. Both are wrong, in different
ways, for the Northern English and the Irish and the Scots.
>>
>> Any attempt to characterize phonetic realization of Lojban phonemes in
terms of English words is likely to engender confusions like this. In 2016
you can use IPA linked to Wikipedia, or IPA with embedded sound files, or
just sound files.
>
>
> And, would "ya" in "yard" suffice?

It's better, in that it's wrong for far fewer dialects (it's wrong for
pockets of southern Lancashire, for instance, but pockets of southern
Lancashire are but small areas of the globe); but that explanatory strategy
is pretty much doomed to fail for at least some readers.

--And.

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<p dir=3D"ltr"><br>
On 2 Mar 2016 08:42, &quot;Gleki Arxokuna&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gleki=
.is.my.name@gmail.com">gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; 2016-03-02 11:16 GMT+03:00 And Rosta &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:and.rosta@g=
mail.com">and.rosta@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; On 2 Mar 2016 07:42, &quot;Luke Bergen&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:lukeabergen@gmail.com">lukeabergen@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; Found my way to <a href=3D"https://mw.lojban.org/papri/The_Cr=
ash_Course_(a_draft)">https://mw.lojban.org/papri/The_Crash_Course_(a_draft=
)</a> and noticed &quot;ia is pronounced as yu in yummy&quot;. Is this true=
? I thought given the pronunciation of &quot;a&quot; that &quot;ia&quot; wo=
uld be pronounced more like &quot;yo&quot; as in &quot;yonder&quot; or &quo=
t;beyond&quot;.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; I&#39;d think if you wanted to make the &quot;yu&quot; as in =
&quot;yummy&quot; sound in lojban the closest thing would be &quot;iy&quot;=
<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; Am I wrong in this?<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; You&#39;re right for North Americans. The crash course is right fo=
r the Southern English and Southern Hemisphereans. Both are wrong, in diffe=
rent ways, for the Northern English and the Irish and the Scots.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; Any attempt to characterize phonetic realization of Lojban phoneme=
s in terms of English words is likely to engender confusions like this. In =
2016 you can use IPA linked to Wikipedia, or IPA with embedded sound files,=
 or just sound files.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; And, would &quot;ya&quot; in &quot;yard&quot; suffice?</p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">It&#39;s better, in that it&#39;s wrong for far fewer dialec=
ts (it&#39;s wrong for pockets of southern Lancashire, for instance, but po=
ckets of southern Lancashire are but small areas of the globe); but that ex=
planatory strategy is pretty much doomed to fail for at least some readers.=
</p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">--And.</p>

<p></p>

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