Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 05:10:42 -0800 (PST)
From: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com
To: lojban <lojban@googlegroups.com>
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Subject: [lojban] Re: CLL and modern Lojban
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Em domingo, 5 de novembro de 2017 13:01:39 UTC+3, Benoit Neil escreveu:
>
> coi
>
> I recently stumbled upon a document (le teris...) which was in declined in 
> two versions: "CLL Lojban 
> <https://mw.lojban.org/papri/la_.teris._po%27u_lo_tirxu_cu_vitke_zi%27o_le_barda_tcadu>" 
> and "modern Lojban 
> <https://mw.lojban.org/papri/la_.teris._ku_noi_tigra_cu_stuvi%27e_lo_barda_tcadu>". 
> I don't understand why.
>
>    - What is the status of "modern Lojban"? Is it a kind of beta / 
>    pre-release / proposal? Or is there a *schism */ fork, were a group 
>    prefer one version over the other?
>
>
This is a long standing issue. As shanoxilt once correctly noted Lojban was 
hijacked by a clique of so called fluent speakers.
They started forking never completing any printed documentation of they 
were doing. Firs they change the meaning of the particle {lo}, then tried 
to implement other changes including even the formal grammar.

When people try to speak to fluent speakers they are immediately faced with 
these discprepancies between The Complete Lojban Language book and views of 
particular people. You can imagine all the negative consequences of this 
situation.

But in spite of deterioration of Lojban community and its inability to 
produce any fruitful results still Lojban is pretty much how The Complete 
Lojban Language describes it.
E.g. learning a revised meaning {lo} is no big deal.


>    - What are (in a few words) the differences between the two? *Why *choose 
>    one or another?
>    - Where is the reference documentation of "modern Lojban"?
>
> .i ki'e ro do
> .i co'o
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><br>Em domingo, 5 de novembro de 2017 13:01:39 UTC+3, =
Benoit Neil  escreveu:<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;=
margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div>coi</div><div><br></div><div>I recently stumbled upon a docum=
ent (le teris...) which was in declined in two versions: &quot;<a href=3D"h=
ttps://mw.lojban.org/papri/la_.teris._po%27u_lo_tirxu_cu_vitke_zi%27o_le_ba=
rda_tcadu" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"nofollow" onmousedown=3D"this.href=3D&#=
39;https://www.google.com/url?q\x3dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmw.lojban.org%2Fpapri%2Fla=
_.teris._po%2527u_lo_tirxu_cu_vitke_zi%2527o_le_barda_tcadu\x26sa\x3dD\x26s=
ntz\x3d1\x26usg\x3dAFQjCNG0B0rA6EAKdn1Yin1xWPM0rVsSDw&#39;;return true;" on=
click=3D"this.href=3D&#39;https://www.google.com/url?q\x3dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmw.=
lojban.org%2Fpapri%2Fla_.teris._po%2527u_lo_tirxu_cu_vitke_zi%2527o_le_bard=
a_tcadu\x26sa\x3dD\x26sntz\x3d1\x26usg\x3dAFQjCNG0B0rA6EAKdn1Yin1xWPM0rVsSD=
w&#39;;return true;">CLL Lojban</a>&quot; and &quot;<a href=3D"https://mw.l=
ojban.org/papri/la_.teris._ku_noi_tigra_cu_stuvi%27e_lo_barda_tcadu" target=
=3D"_blank" rel=3D"nofollow" onmousedown=3D"this.href=3D&#39;https://www.go=
ogle.com/url?q\x3dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmw.lojban.org%2Fpapri%2Fla_.teris._ku_noi_t=
igra_cu_stuvi%2527e_lo_barda_tcadu\x26sa\x3dD\x26sntz\x3d1\x26usg\x3dAFQjCN=
ESO8ZnGhCfPL8PG82nfd1sZvYgLA&#39;;return true;" onclick=3D"this.href=3D&#39=
;https://www.google.com/url?q\x3dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmw.lojban.org%2Fpapri%2Fla_.=
teris._ku_noi_tigra_cu_stuvi%2527e_lo_barda_tcadu\x26sa\x3dD\x26sntz\x3d1\x=
26usg\x3dAFQjCNESO8ZnGhCfPL8PG82nfd1sZvYgLA&#39;;return true;">modern Lojba=
n</a>&quot;. I don&#39;t understand why.</div><div><ul><li>What is the stat=
us of &quot;modern Lojban&quot;? Is it a kind of beta / pre-release / propo=
sal? Or is there a <b>schism </b>/ fork, were a group prefer one version ov=
er the other?</li></ul></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>This is=
 a long standing issue. As shanoxilt once correctly noted Lojban was hijack=
ed by a clique of so called fluent speakers.</div><div>They started forking=
 never completing any printed documentation of they were doing. Firs they c=
hange the meaning of the particle {lo}, then tried to implement other chang=
es including even the formal grammar.</div><div><br></div><div>When people =
try to speak to fluent speakers they are immediately faced with these discp=
repancies between The Complete Lojban Language book and views of particular=
 people. You can imagine all the negative consequences of this situation.</=
div><div><br></div><div>But in spite of deterioration of Lojban community a=
nd its inability to produce any fruitful results still Lojban is pretty muc=
h how The Complete Lojban Language describes it.</div><div>E.g. learning a =
revised meaning {lo} is no big deal.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #cc=
c solid;padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><ul><li>What are (in a fe=
w words) the differences between the two? <b>Why </b>choose one or another?=
<br></li><li>Where is the reference documentation of &quot;modern Lojban&qu=
ot;?</li></ul><div>.i ki&#39;e ro do</div></div><div>.i co&#39;o</div><div>=
<br></div></div></blockquote></div>

<p></p>

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