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Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2017 13:18:28 +0000 (UTC)
From: "'John E Clifford' via lojban" <lojban@googlegroups.com>
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Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: CLL and modern Lojban
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 Content preview:  Not bitter, merely dismayed and very sad.  40 years ago
   Logjam seemed to have great promise, but (as I later found) it had already
    spent its promise and, despite years fiddling and a couple of almost total
    restarts, has only gotten further and further from its goal (monoparsing
   possibly aside).  The only real fix I can conceive is to junk everything
   you have now (except as a pile of spare parts, some of which may eventually
    be of use) and go back to square one, with a a higher order intensional logic
    rather than FOPL and a careful, step by step construction by reversable transformations.
     Good luck with any phase of that plan. [...] 
 
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 Not bitter, merely dismayed and very sad. =C2=A040 years ago Logjam seemed=
 to have great promise, but (as I later found) it had already spent its pro=
mise and, despite years fiddling and a couple of almost total restarts, has=
 only gotten further and further from its goal (monoparsing possibly aside)=
. =C2=A0The only real fix I can conceive is to junk everything you have now=
 (except as a pile of spare parts, some of which may eventually be of use) =
and go back to square one, with a a higher order intensional logic rather t=
han FOPL and a careful, step by step construction by reversable transformat=
ions. =C2=A0Good luck with any phase of that plan.

    On Tuesday, November 7, 2017, 3:51:29 AM CST, <sukender1@gmail.com> wro=
te: =20
=20
 @stevo: Sorry I don't understand the "make it the same as it was before". =
From my point of view:  =20
   - Establishing language rules "forever" is not possible. Therefore some =
changes will be necessary. This is what called "evolution".
   - Forking may be interesting. It may be an pure experiment, a "feature b=
ranch", a fix, etc.
   - Reintegrating a branch to the core actually changes the core! This is =
why it must be done very carefully, in order to not break initial intents o=
f the language.
I hope I mad myself clearer :-)


Le mardi 7 novembre 2017 09:59:20 UTC+1, stevo a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0:
sykynder: You mention re-integrating forks back into the core language. How=
 do you change something and then make it the same as it was before? And wh=
y would you want to?=C2=A0=C2=A0stevo


--=20
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 =20

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<html><head></head><body><div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetic=
a, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px;"><div></div>
            <div>Not bitter, merely dismayed and very sad. &nbsp;40 years a=
go Logjam seemed to have great promise, but (as I later found) it had alrea=
dy spent its promise and, despite years fiddling and a couple of almost tot=
al restarts, has only gotten further and further from its goal (monoparsing=
 possibly aside). &nbsp;The only real fix I can conceive is to junk everyth=
ing you have now (except as a pile of spare parts, some of which may eventu=
ally be of use) and go back to square one, with a a higher order intensiona=
l logic rather than FOPL and a careful, step by step construction by revers=
able transformations. &nbsp;Good luck with any phase of that plan.</div><di=
v><br></div><div><br></div>
           =20
            <div id=3D"yahoo_quoted_0485926342" class=3D"yahoo_quoted">
                <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Aria=
l, sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
                   =20
                    <div>
                        On Tuesday, November 7, 2017, 3:51:29 AM CST,  &lt;=
sukender1@gmail.com&gt; wrote:
                    </div>
                    <div><br></div>
                    <div><br></div>
                    <div><div id=3D"yiv2016176301"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><d=
iv>@stevo: Sorry I don't understand the "make it the same as it was before"=
. From my point of view:</div><div><ul><li>Establishing language rules "for=
ever" is not possible. Therefore some changes will be necessary. This is wh=
at called "evolution".</li><li>Forking may be interesting. It may be an pur=
e experiment, a "feature branch", a fix, etc.</li><li>Reintegrating a branc=
h to the core actually changes the core! This is why it must be done <b>ver=
y carefully</b>, in order to not break initial intents of the language.</li=
></ul></div>I hope I mad myself clearer :-)<div><br clear=3D"none"></div><d=
iv><br clear=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv2016176301yqt2946525893" id=3D"yiv20=
16176301yqtfd86613"><br clear=3D"none">Le mardi 7 novembre 2017 09:59:20 UT=
C+1, stevo a =C3=A9crit&nbsp;:<blockquote class=3D"yiv2016176301gmail_quote=
" style=3D"margin:0;margin-left:0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-le=
ft:1ex;"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div style=3D"font-family:courier new, monospace;=
">sykynder: You mention re-integrating forks back into the core language. H=
ow do you change something and then make it the same as it was before? And =
why would you want to?&nbsp;</div><div style=3D"font-family:courier new, mo=
nospace;">&nbsp;</div><div style=3D"font-family:courier new, monospace;">st=
evo</div></div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div>
</blockquote></div></div></div><div class=3D"yiv2016176301yqt2946525893" id=
=3D"yiv2016176301yqtfd01338">

<p></p>

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<p></p>

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