Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 2020 10:30:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com>
To: lojban <lojban@googlegroups.com>
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Subject: Re: [lojban] Why Lojban fails
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Em domingo, 12 de abril de 2020 19:44:25 UTC+3, Mike S. escreveu:
>
> On Sun, Apr 12, 2020 at 12:13 PM Gleki Arxokuna <
> gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Em domingo, 12 de abril de 2020 18:01:38 UTC+3, Mike S. escreveu:
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 12, 2020 at 9:55 AM 'John E Clifford' via lojban <
>>> lojban@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Oh, my!  I merely meant to drop a friendly reminder that Lojban could=
=20
>>>> not achieve its goal as presently constituted.  KI learn (I=E2=80=99ve=
 been away a=20
>>>> while) Lojbanists (of some sort or other or maybe all) no longer car a=
bout=20
>>>> its primary goal, monoparsing, but are concerned to make a viable lang=
uage=20
>>>> out of the scraps.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Do you have evidence that the Lojbanist community as a whole has=20
>>> abandoned the goal of "monoparsing" (which I take to mean self-segregat=
ing=20
>>> morphology and unambiguous grammar)? =20
>>>
>>
>> I have one. When I asked about inconsistencies in the PEG grammar I was=
=20
>> given an answer that some semantic parser should do that job. However, n=
o=20
>> such parser was envisioned at that time. So yes, it's avoiding the topic=
 of=20
>> not abandoning it at all.
>>
>
> This is your evidence that monoparsing has been abandoned?  If monoparsin=
g=20
> were abandoned, no one would be writing PEG grammars in the first place. =
=20
>
>

From the time camxes was born there has been no progress. They all got=20
stuck in peg formalism and tinkering camxes.=20

>
>> Even within ordinary AST system there are no discussions of internal=20
>> grammar of UI or fu'e. It's a topic for geeks maybe that's the reason.
>>
>
> Or of PA.  Meanwhile, it seems to me that BAI and FA and others could hav=
e=20
> been combined.  So yeah the syntactic categories could have been both spl=
it=20
> and lumped differently.=20
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><br>Em domingo, 12 de abril de 2020 19:44:25 UTC+3, Mi=
ke S.  escreveu:<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin=
-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Sun, Apr 12, 2020 at 12:1=
3 PM Gleki Arxokuna &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com" targe=
t=3D"_blank" rel=3D"nofollow" onmousedown=3D"this.href=3D&#39;mailto:gleki.=
is.my.name@gmail.com&#39;;return true;" onclick=3D"this.href=3D&#39;mailto:=
gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com&#39;;return true;">gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com</a=
>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px=
 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><di=
v dir=3D"ltr"><br>Em domingo, 12 de abril de 2020 18:01:38 UTC+3, Mike S.  =
escreveu:<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8e=
x;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div d=
ir=3D"ltr"></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Sun, Ap=
r 12, 2020 at 9:55 AM &#39;John E Clifford&#39; via lojban &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:lojban@googlegroups.com" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank" onmousedo=
wn=3D"this.href=3D&#39;mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com&#39;;return true;" on=
click=3D"this.href=3D&#39;mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com&#39;;return true;"=
>lojban@googlegroups.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail=
_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204=
,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue,Helve=
tica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><div></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr">Oh, my!=C2=A0 I merely meant to drop a friendly re=
minder that Lojban could not achieve its goal as presently constituted.=C2=
=A0 KI learn (I=E2=80=99ve been away a while) Lojbanists (of some sort or o=
ther or maybe all) no longer car about its primary goal, monoparsing, but a=
re concerned to make a viable language out of the scraps.</div></div></div>=
</blockquote><div><br></div><div>Do you have evidence that the Lojbanist co=
mmunity as a whole has abandoned the goal of &quot;monoparsing&quot; (which=
 I take to mean self-segregating morphology and unambiguous grammar)?=C2=A0=
 </div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div=
>I have one. When I asked about inconsistencies in the PEG grammar I was gi=
ven an answer that some semantic parser should do that job. However, no suc=
h parser was envisioned at that time. So yes, it&#39;s avoiding the topic o=
f not abandoning it at all.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Thi=
s is your evidence that monoparsing has been abandoned?=C2=A0 If monoparsin=
g were abandoned, no one would be writing PEG grammars in the first place.=
=C2=A0 <br><br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div=
><div>From the time camxes was born there has been no progress. They all go=
t stuck in peg formalism and tinkering camxes.=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left: 0.8ex;border-left: 1px #cc=
c solid;padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><di=
v></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">=
<div><br></div><div>Even within ordinary AST system there are no discussion=
s of internal grammar of UI or fu&#39;e. It&#39;s a topic for geeks maybe t=
hat&#39;s the reason.</div></div></blockquote><br></div><div class=3D"gmail=
_quote">Or of PA.=C2=A0 Meanwhile, it seems to me that BAI and FA and other=
s could have been combined.=C2=A0 So yeah the syntactic categories could ha=
ve been both split and lumped differently.=C2=A0</div></div></blockquote></=
div>

<p></p>

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