Envelope-to: lojban-list-archive@lojban.org
Delivery-date: Sun, 29 Aug 2021 14:53:30 -0700
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::335 as permitted sender) client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::335;
Subject: [lojban] Re: Help parsing Lojban from Python? (Hey, Riley! :)
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
References: <20210827021139.GO309000@gmail.com>
 <B6AB9786-1025-4F5E-A196-C83556B8EDC6@gmail.com>
 <20210828040224.GS309000@gmail.com>
 <CAB-HkawLxFuQZT8_vuZf8wmudq=kBkY=y5yC=OWom2fNyvQANw@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210829175938.GA1107525@gmail.com>
From: Ilmen <ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7df1103d-6eab-3aa2-2147-2630325ad11e@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2021 23:52:19 +0200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101
 Firefox/78.0 Thunderbird/78.13.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <20210829175938.GA1107525@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Language: fr
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
X-Spam_score: -2.5
X-Spam_score_int: -24
X-Spam_bar: --

Javascript Camxes (Ilmentufa) is at:

=E2=80=A2 https://github.com/lojban/ilmentufa/=20
<https://github.com/lojban/ilmentufa/>=E2=80=83(repository)

=E2=80=A2 https://lojban.github.io/ilmentufa/camxes.html=20
<https://lojban.github.io/ilmentufa/camxes.html>=E2=80=83(one of the HTML=
=20
interfaces)

=E2=80=A2 https://lojban.github.io/ilmentufa/glosser/glosser.htm=20
<https://lojban.github.io/ilmentufa/glosser/glosser.htm>=E2=80=83(another H=
TML=20
interface, allowing nested boxes output)

Ilmentufa can also be used via command line by running "run_camxes.js"=20
with Node.js (see the readme file for details).

=E2=80=94Ilmen.


On 2021-08-29, Robin Lee Powell wrote:
> Oh, it turns out I was looking in the "wrong" repo:
> https://github.com/lojban/camxes-py has the Python 3 stuff done
> already, by mezohe
>
> On Sun, Aug 29, 2021 at 10:12:56AM -0400, Riley Lynch wrote:
>> I'm going to be spending most of the day driving, but before I do that,
>> I'll try to address a few questions here, and then can follow up by mail=
 or
>> IRC.
>>
>> (1) I want to confirm that camxes-py is the preferred Python option
>> these days
>>
>> I'm not aware of other parsers in python. I specifically developed the
>> parser because I wanted a python implementation to complement your java
>> implementation and Masato and Ilmen's javascript parsers.
> Well, there's https://github.com/lojban/python-camxes :)
>
>> I notice now that Randall Holmes has developed a Python PEG parser for
>> Loglan.
>>
>> (2) I want to be able to run =E2=80=A6  it in a direct, straightforward =
way =E2=80=A6 and
>> tree should contain an obvious python representation of the
>> parse tree
>> (5) Make a mode that collapses productions with only one child
>>
>> Running will be the easy part. The representation of the parse tree rais=
es
>> some interesting questions.
> I'm *far* more interested in someone else doing the running part,
> FWIW; I feel competent to play with the parse tree after the fact,
> but I don't really know idiomatic Python so if I try to make a
> library out of what's there it's going to suck.
>
>> For camxes-py, I created a transformation of the parse tree which
>> replicated the output of Ilmentufa. I did this so that I could run again=
st
>> the test corpus that you set up for java camxes and verify not only that
>> the python parser could accept the same corpus as the java and javascrip=
t
>> parsers, but that it was comprehending the same structures.
>>
>> That said, the output exposes a lot of the mechanics of the parser
>> specification and obscures the semantics. Ideally, I'd like for the test
>> suites to target compatibility with a semantically-structured
>> representation of the parse. There's been some work on Ilmentufa to
>> post-process the parse tree into something more palatable. Have you take=
n a
>> look at that?
> Nope, I actually didn't realize that ilmentufa was a thing until
> this conversation.  (I'd heard of it, but didn't know what it was.)
>
> (Side comment: the "About" page for both camxes and jboski now
> points to all alternatives I'm aware of.)
>
>> (3) Update to most-recent parsimonious; it currently breaks on 0.8.1, bu=
t
>> works on 0.6.2
>>
>> I wrote against the most recent version of parsimonious at that time. Gl=
ad
>> to see work has continued. I remember the author was working on some
>> performance enhancements, and one problem with camxes-py in its current
>> form is that it is slow.
> Again, I'm perfectly happy to do that part, fwiw.
>
>> (4) Update to Python 3
>>
>> I agree that this should be done.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Aug 28, 2021 at 12:02 AM Robin Lee Powell <robinleepowell@gmail.=
com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Feel free to come find me on Libera IRC, or suggest a preferred chat
>>> option for you.
>>>
>>> The stuff I want is actually quite simple, though:
>>>
>>> (1) I want to confirm that camxes-py is the preferred Python option
>>> these days
>>>
>>> (2) I want to be able to run "run" (see
>>> https://github.com/teleological/camxes-py/blob/master/camxes.py#L89
>>> ) or something like it in a direct, straightforward way, i.e.:
>>>
>>>            import camxespy
>>>            tree =3D camxespy.run("mi klama", transformer=3D'camxes-morp=
hology')
>>>
>>> , and tree should contain an obvious python representation of the
>>> parse tree.
>>>
>>> This requires, AFAICT (I don't actually know Python very well) that
>>> camxes-py have a library struture to it that it doesn't currently
>>> have and that the options be configurable in some way other than
>>> OptionParser.
>>>
>>> I can actually do all that myself, but I'm not really a pythonista
>>> and what I do won't be idiomatic at all.
>>>
>>> Stretch goals:
>>>
>>> (3) Update to most-recent parsimonious; it currently breaks on
>>> 0.8.1, but works on 0.6.2
>>>
>>> (4) Update to Python 3, but I'm perfectly capable of making a PR for
>>> this myself.
>>>
>>> (5) Make a mode that collapses productions with only one child, i.e.
>>> make the output look like this (in terms of productions not syntax):
>>>
>>>          rlpowell@stodi> echo "mi klama" | camxes -f
>>>          Flat layout requested.
>>>           text=3D(  sentence=3D(  CMAVO=3D(  KOhA=3D( mi )  )  BRIVLA=
=3D(  gismu=3D(
>>> klama )  )  )  )
>>>
>>> Instead of this:
>>>
>>> root@66324b4aed4b:/src# python camxes.py "mi klama"
>>>
>>> ["text",["text_1",["paragraphs",["paragraph",["statement",["statement_1=
",["statement_2",["statement_3",["sentence",[["terms",["terms_1",["terms_2"=
,["abs_term",["abs_term_1",["sumti",["sumti_1",["sumti_2",["sumti_3",["sumt=
i_4",["sumti_5",["sumti_6",["KOhA_clause",[["KOhA","mi"]]]]]]]]]]]]]]],["CU=
"]],["bridi_tail",["bridi_tail_1",["bridi_tail_2",["bridi_tail_3",["selbri"=
,["selbri_1",["selbri_2",["selbri_3",["selbri_4",["selbri_5",["selbri_6",["=
tanru_unit",["tanru_unit_1",["tanru_unit_2",["BRIVLA_clause",[["BRIVLA",["g=
ismu","klama"]]]]]]]]]]]]]],["tail_terms",["VAU"]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
>>>
>>> , but as I said before this is not hard to do after the fact once
>>> you have the parse tree.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2021 at 11:15:54PM -0400, Riley Martinez-Lynch
>>> wrote:
>>>> Robin, I'd be happy to make whatever changes are needed to make it
>>>> work. I don't see the CLI interface as an essential part of the
>>>> interface, and if I can do something to make it easier to access
>>>> programmatically, I'd like to do that. Glad to take cues here, or
>>>> if you wanted to jump on a call or chat, can do that too.
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 26, 2021, at 10:11 PM, Robin Lee Powell <
>>> robinleepowell@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> =EF=BB=BF
>>>>> In service to making certain parts of the lojban.org infra a bit
>>>>> more resilient, I'm updating some stuff that uses
>>>>> https://github.com/lojban/python-camxes .  This relies on java and
>>>>> the camxes jar, which, whatever, but it's also built on LEPL, which
>>>>> no longer works (see for example
>>>>> https://github.com/modoboa/modoboa/issues/1780 ).
>>>>>
>>>>> https://github.com/teleological/camxes-py is a pure Python
>>>>> replacement, but is a CLI program rather than a library; it's really
>>>>> not designed to be used as a library.  I'd love it if someone
>>>>> updated and fixed that.
>>>>>
>>>>> Unless there's another option?  What's the state of the art in this
>>>>> space?
>>>>>

--=20
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
lojban" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e=
mail to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/=
lojban/7df1103d-6eab-3aa2-2147-2630325ad11e%40gmail.com.