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Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2023 08:44:50 -0800
From: Robin Lee Powell <robinleepowell@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban] Question about tanru, incidental relative clauses, and
 misleading language
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I think you accidentally a sentence. :D

On Sun, Feb 12, 2023 at 07:11:34AM -0500, Michael Turniansky wrote:
> I would agree with
> 
> On Sat, Feb 11, 2023 at 8:28 PM .arpis. <rpglover64+jbobau@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I haven't really engaged with Lojban in years, but I recently had a few
> > run-ins with things I like about Lojban, which prompted me with a question
> > that I couldn't resolve myself, so I figured I'd ask.
> >
> > I really like the fact that "noi" and "poi" are distinct and that there is
> > no way to have a relative clause (or an appositive) that is ambiguous
> > between restrictive and incidental. I then wondered if you could sneak that
> > ambiguity into a tanru. I think the answer is yes: "lo mi xunre karce"
> > could be either "lo mi karce poi xunre" or "lo mi karce noi xunre", right?
> > After all, if "lo gerku zdani" is broad enough to be able to refer to a
> > house that a dog once slept in, why not?
> >
> > If that's the case, I wonder if tanru enable a particular kind of
> > misleading language pattern I've recently been introduced to: cat
> > couplings
> > <https://everythingstudies.com/2021/07/18/cat-couplings-revisited/>. They
> > leverage the ambiguity between a restrictive and non-restrictive sense of a
> > compound phrase to presuppose a natural concept expressed by the phrase.
> > The article has many examples in English; I'm going to go with "stupid
> > American" (because it's easy to translate).
> >
> > "mi bebna merpre .i ku'i co'e" implies "lo ka merpre bebna cu zasti" (i.e.
> > that American stupidity exists as a concept).
> >
> > Am I correct that the ambiguity in tanru allows this kind of sneaky
> > implication just as in English? If not, why not?
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
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> >
> 
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