From sentto-44114-16273-1033399960-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Mon Sep 30 08:36:13 2002 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:36:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from n35.grp.scd.yahoo.com ([66.218.66.103]) by digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.05) id 17w2ag-000193-00 for lojban-in@lojban.org; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:36:10 -0700 X-eGroups-Return: sentto-44114-16273-1033399960-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Received: from [66.218.66.94] by n35.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Sep 2002 15:32:40 -0000 X-Sender: arosta@uclan.ac.uk X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 30 Sep 2002 15:32:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 37458 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 15:32:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Sep 2002 15:32:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO com1.uclan.ac.uk) (193.61.255.3) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 15:32:39 -0000 Received: from gwise-gw1.uclan.ac.uk by com1.uclan.ac.uk with SMTP (Mailer); Mon, 30 Sep 2002 15:58:34 +0100 Received: from DI1-Message_Server by gwise-gw1.uclan.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 16:31:19 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.5.2 To: lojban From: And Rosta X-Yahoo-Profile: andjamin MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list lojban@yahoogroups.com; contact lojban-owner@yahoogroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list lojban@yahoogroups.com Precedence: bulk Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 16:31:03 +0100 Subject: [lojban] LOI PRENU GO PA MEI GI KA'E NAI TE JINGA? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-archive-position: 1761 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: arosta@uclan.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list >>> Jorge Llambias 09/30/02 03:57pm >>> #la and cusku di'e #>And it seems to me that the necessary condition for the people to #>resist defeat is that they *be* united, not that they have *become* #>united. Even if they always were united, right from the outset, they #>would still never be defeated. # #Yes, you're right. I think I can see now a bit more clearly #what bothered me about {lei prenu ku poi pamei}. In "el pueblo, #unido", the adjective is not used to select which people I'm #talking about, but rather which state of an already identified #people. (Not "any people which is united", but "this people when #it is united". Actually, not even "this", because "the people" #I think is taken as a singular reference, the only people that #there are.) So, can {poi} be used to select from different #worlds for the same referent? So "a people that is united will never be defeated" is not an adequate translation, for you? = {loi prenu ku poi pa mei} How about {loi prenu go pa mei gi ka'e nai te jinga} that sounds pretty coolass to me -- something John might consent to chant. But it won't work if GA can occur tanru internally, which it probably can. But in that case, maybe, helsemously, it could be PRENU GO PA MEI GI KA'E NAI TE JINGA? or GU'EPRE GO PA MEI GI KA'E NAI TE JINGA? --And. _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> 4 DVDs Free +s&p Join Now http://us.click.yahoo.com/pt6YBB/NXiEAA/MVfIAA/GSaulB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/