From sentto-44114-17174-1037893175-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Thu Nov 21 10:21:08 2002 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:21:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com ([66.218.66.92]) by digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.05) id 18Evwn-0000pq-00 for lojban-in@lojban.org; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:21:05 -0800 X-eGroups-Return: sentto-44114-17174-1037893175-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Received: from [66.218.67.198] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 15:39:36 -0000 X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 15:39:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 76277 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 15:39:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 15:39:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.223) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 15:39:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 07:39:35 -0800 Received: from 200.49.74.2 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 15:39:34 GMT To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 15:39:35.0331 (UTC) FILETIME=[318C5730:01C29174] From: "Jorge Llambias" X-Originating-IP: [200.49.74.2] X-Yahoo-Profile: jjllambias2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list lojban@yahoogroups.com; contact lojban-owner@yahoogroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list lojban@yahoogroups.com Precedence: bulk Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 15:39:34 +0000 Subject: [lojban] Re: mi nanca li (was: Re: Newbie says hi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-archive-position: 2660 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list la and cusku di'e >Idioms are very mabla toljbo, and hence {mi nanca li 18} is too. We need >a better way to say it, which generalizes to all measurements of duration: > >"The (linear) time from inception of x1 to (punctual) time x3 is x2 units >in duration." I don't agree that {mi nanca li cixa} is an idiom. I think {nanca} already means what you want, except that time x3 is the time of the event. Otherwise you have to take {nanca} as an atemporal predicate, but normal predicates in Lojban are not forcedly atemporal, so why force {nanca} to be one? We can say: {ca li pasobici mi nanca li paze}, "In 1983 I was 17", or {ca li renoreno mi nanca li muvo romu'ei le du'u mi za'o jmive}, "In 2020 I will be 54 if I'm still alive". There is nothing strange about {mi} nanca-ing different numbers at different times. The other perspective, considering that {mi} labels some timeless object with a duration that goes from birth to death, does not seem to be all that useful. >This would generalize to, say, "At that time, I had been living in London >for 8 months", as well as to "I am 18 years old". I would say: {ca le co'e le nu mi xabju la londn cu masti li bi}. mu'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/