From sentto-44114-21805-1080164910-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Wed Mar 24 19:52:16 2004 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:52:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com ([66.218.66.69]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.30) id 1B6Luc-0006gi-NM for lojban-in@lojban.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:52:10 -0800 X-eGroups-Return: sentto-44114-21805-1080164910-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Received: from [66.218.67.193] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Mar 2004 21:49:23 -0000 X-Sender: jcowan@reutershealth.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 88502 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2004 21:48:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Mar 2004 21:48:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.reutershealth.com) (65.246.141.36) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Mar 2004 21:48:28 -0000 Received: from skunk.reutershealth.com (mail [65.246.141.36]) by mail.reutershealth.com (Pro-8.9.3/Pro-8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA19637; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 16:42:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by skunk.reutershealth.com (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Wed, 24 Mar 2004 16:48:21 -0500 To: "xahlee.org" Cc: lojban@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: <20040324214821.GH19914@skunk.reutershealth.com> References: <200403242119.i2OLJOG12020@xahlee.org> In-Reply-To: <200403242119.i2OLJOG12020@xahlee.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 65.246.141.36 From: jcowan@reutershealth.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list lojban@yahoogroups.com; contact lojban-owner@yahoogroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list lojban@yahoogroups.com Precedence: bulk Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 16:48:21 -0500 Subject: [lojban] Re: reply to a negated selbri Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-archive-position: 7309 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jcowan@reutershealth.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list xahlee.org scripsit: > * it is not well-known how average English speaker responds to negated > question. (assuming that average English speaker does in fact respone > in one way.) Well, it's well-known to native speakers, who are primarily the ones addressed. > So for example, if someone asks: > > This is not white? > > and i wanted to reply that it is white, i think average English speaker > would answer "yes". (more likely: "that's right!"). Not at all. The answer would be "no" in this case, i.e. "No, that is not white". The presence of "not" in the question is completely disregarded. In the other case, one says "It *is* white", as "Yes" by itself would be confusing: one might instead say "On the contrary". This pattern varies from one language to another. In Russian and Japanese, one replies "logically": "yes" means "Yes, that is not white", and "no" means "No, that is white". In French and German as in English, "non/nein" means "No, that is not white", but the affirmative form is different from the regular affirmative ("si" instead of "oui" in French, "doch" instead of "ja" in German). > According to the "What is lojban" paragraph cited above, if we have > a conversation thus: > A: "xu ti na blabi" > B: "na go'i" > > what B is means is that "it is not white". Am i right here? Yes, you are right. -- "No, John. I want formats that are actually John Cowan useful, rather than over-featured megaliths that http://www.ccil.org/~cowan address all questions by piling on ridiculous http://www.reutershealth.com internal links in forms which are hideously jcowan@reutershealth.com over-complex." --Simon St. Laurent on xml-dev ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US & Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/GSaulB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lojban-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/