From sentto-44114-23789-1107136033-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Sun Jan 30 17:47:59 2005 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sun, 30 Jan 2005 17:48:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from n13a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com ([66.94.237.24]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CvQfI-0001sm-Hs for lojban-in@lojban.org; Sun, 30 Jan 2005 17:47:44 -0800 Received: from [66.218.69.5] by n13.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2005 01:47:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.158] by mailer5.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2005 01:47:13 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-email X-Sender: lojbab@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 26721 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2005 01:47:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2005 01:47:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakermmtao06.cox.net) (68.230.240.33) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2005 01:47:10 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (really [24.250.99.39]) by lakermmtao06.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.04.00 201-2131-117-20041022) with ESMTP id <20050131014708.VXNM6774.lakermmtao06.cox.net@[127.0.0.1]> for ; Sun, 30 Jan 2005 20:47:08 -0500 Message-ID: <41FD8E24.1020304@lojban.org> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.8 (Windows/20040913) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en To: lojban@yahoogroups.com References: In-Reply-To: X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 68.230.240.33 From: Bob LeChevalier X-Yahoo-Profile: lojbab MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list lojban@yahoogroups.com; contact lojban-owner@yahoogroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list lojban@yahoogroups.com Precedence: bulk Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2005 20:47:16 -0500 Subject: [lojban] Re: [lojban] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-archive-position: 9381 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lojbab@lojban.org Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list xah lee wrote: >>(i don't think lojban is ever suitable for human communication as >>with natural languages. >> >> >>Do you have any basis for that opinion? >> >> >essentially that humans are not logical machines.... in any natural >situation communication far outruns any logical concern... employing >body language, context, situational... and perhaps the actual literal >content in speech plays only some 10% of all thins communicated. In >emergency, love affairs, power play, ... any situation... all these >things are happening implicitly, even among you the reader and me right >at this moment. The only exception is say idol chat among linguists >inside sealed ivy towers (as the case of online lojban chat or in this >forum.). > >so in natural settings, lojban will be broken as soon as it is used for >real... just as people constant break English. > So your argument is that you don't think that "lojban is ever suitable for human communication as with natural languages" because people will break the rules just as they do for English. By that reasoning however, Russian, French and Chinese will never "be suitable for human communication", because people will break the rules just as they do for English. Either that, or you have to prove that Lojban is LESS suitable than the other languages for human communication when people DO break the rules, which might be true but would be hard to prove until we have fluent speakers facing the sorts of situation where unsuitability would occur. Lojban would not be a failure as a language merely because people do not always speak it flawlessly. I'm bothered when I see people setting a higher standard for Lojbanic success than they do for success of English. lojbab ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Has someone you know been affected by illness or disease? Network for Good is THE place to support health awareness efforts! http://us.click.yahoo.com/RzSHvD/UOnJAA/79vVAA/GSaulB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lojban-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/