From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Sep 27 19:13:33 2005 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:13:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EKRRj-0005AW-AH for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:13:23 -0700 Received: from web81302.mail.yahoo.com ([206.190.37.77]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EKRRg-0005AL-3u for lojban-list@lojban.org; Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:13:23 -0700 Received: (qmail 60034 invoked by uid 60001); 28 Sep 2005 02:13:18 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=ZMe35xEnSblAI++KfgT+XA+amEvDz/DX1qPOIKRkTT4mXIwwCj1rUcgdaPL2XupHZp2ptvgiSR/zeRylF5VJcXk4Apt30kxp5GI6i5WPIl96Kxtpc/GoIXbouNctL36xPuQIdbmi2Eo5olT2sKLzK/V9Y80AiiYSRv0bd+PojBY= ; Message-ID: <20050928021318.60032.qmail@web81302.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.88.34.50] by web81302.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:13:18 PDT Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:13:18 -0700 (PDT) From: John E Clifford Subject: [lojban] Re: xorlo podcast To: lojban-list@lojban.org In-Reply-To: <925d17560509271653394ff3c4@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-archive-position: 10655 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: clifford-j@sbcglobal.net Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --- Jorge Llambías wrote: > Here is an example of something that was very > hard to say before > and now is easy: > > mi terpa ci da no'u lo jukni .e lo gerku .e > lo nu le tsani cu farlu > le stedu be mi > "I fear exactly three things: spiders, dogs > and that the sky fall > on my head." for help. That way of putting it suggests that just this would not work to this purpose in prelo. But of course it not only does, but does so directly, without the behind the scenes complexity that xorlo forces on the linguist -- though not, happily, on the speakers. {le broda} refers some specific things the speaker has in mind and which he choses -- hopefully thus making their identity easy to establish -- to call brodas (usually because they are brodas). The same pattern applies for {lei}, those specific guys acting together (there are some complexities here but not yet a problem), and {le'i} the set of which exactly those guys are members. Anything else to refer to things by some property they have -- some predicate they fulfill -- uses {lo} (or where applicable {loi} or {lo'i}. That has always been the rule -- more or less clearly articulated. It applies equally to xorlo and prelo. To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.