From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Oct 28 12:39:21 2005 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Fri, 28 Oct 2005 12:39:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.54) id 1EVa4F-0004V2-Up for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 12:39:12 -0700 Received: from xproxy.gmail.com ([66.249.82.206]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EVa4F-0004Uu-0v for lojban-list@lojban.org; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 12:39:11 -0700 Received: by xproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id h29so490216wxd for ; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 12:39:09 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=dLxaxSwYG260qAAJRhMXXFid1Iu2dZGi8+2Z+WhCyUD77epeYW09Z4b10wSELRVhANp+VlTXrXtNF7YhSM3GhkgPCOgAlYkYzLAmhhTcEk+bj6OFixEHLjtxqAHrfhYebDwORk1Qv3g+P4AR73zyoQ+vQtH5SIzd6g8H4FHSEr4= Received: by 10.70.53.3 with SMTP id b3mr442776wxa; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 12:39:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.117.10 with HTTP; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 12:39:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <12d58c160510281239g30f78bcbs3454b30506e7ca62@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2005 15:39:09 -0400 From: Adam COOPER To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: citri lo glibau In-Reply-To: <925d17560510281139g37adf21cta7dabb247fb1ba61@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_6093_1176428.1130528349702" References: <12d58c160510280915x764d9b8du4ba3f9a68d9742e1@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560510281139g37adf21cta7dabb247fb1ba61@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: -1.6 (-) X-archive-position: 10736 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: adamgarrigus@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list ------=_Part_6093_1176428.1130528349702 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 10/28/05, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > > On 10/28/05, Adam COOPER wrote: > > > pi so'i lo selbau cu ke se sadgunta je tolselctu ke'e natmrkamri > > tercange > > Perhaps you meant: > > (se sadgunta je tolselctu) (ke natmrkamri tercange [ke'e]) > > which would sound more like in English. It is not very clear to > me though why any grouping is necessary, since at least > in a naive logical view the meaning is: > > se sadgunta je tolsectu je natmrkamri je tercange > > One wouldn't say it like that in English, but I can't quite > put my finger on why not. I think {se sadgunta je tolselctu} {ke natmrkamri tercange [ke'e]} *is* wha= t I meant. And I think the undertone is that the peasants were Welsh by birth= , but their being uneducated & conquered were circumstances that could have worked out differently. So {natmrkamri} wants to be bound more closely to {tercange}. That being said, it's an anachronistic view, because back then such a person was as much a peasant by birth as he was Welsh, whereas now you can be born into a tenant farming or small-holding family, but go on to become a poet. But you're still Welsh. mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan ------=_Part_6093_1176428.1130528349702 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 10/28/05, Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com> wrote:
On 10/28/05, Adam COOPER <adam= garrigus@gmail.com> wrote:

> pi so'i lo selbau cu ke se sa= dgunta je tolselctu ke'e natmrkamri
> tercange

Perhaps you mea= nt:

(se sadgunta je tolselctu) (ke natmrkamri tercange [ke'e])

= which would sound more like in English. It is not very clear to
me thoug= h why any grouping is necessary, since at least
in a naive logical view = the meaning is:

se sadgunta je tolsectu je natmrkamri je tercange

One would= n't say it like that in English, but I can't quite
put my finger on why = not.

I think {se sadgunta je tolselctu} {ke natmrkamri tercange [ke'e]} *is* what I meant. And I think the undertone is that the peasants were Welsh by birth, but their being uneducated & conquered were circumstances that could have worked out differently. So {natmrkamri} wants to be bound more closely to {tercange}. That being said, it's an anachronistic view, because back then such a person was as much a peasant by birth as he was Welsh, whereas now you can be born into a tenant farming or small-holding family, but go on to become a poet. But you're still Welsh.

mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan
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