From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Jan 04 08:21:17 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 08:21:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H2VKo-0003Kg-7M for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 08:20:54 -0800 Received: from express.cec.wustl.edu ([128.252.21.16]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H2VKf-0003KY-VG for lojban-list@lojban.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 08:20:53 -0800 Received: from hive.cec.wustl.edu (hive.cec.wustl.edu [128.252.21.14]) by express.cec.wustl.edu (8.13.6/8.12.5) with ESMTP id l04GKdhV015958 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:20:39 -0600 (CST) Received: from hive.cec.wustl.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by hive.cec.wustl.edu (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04GJ3Et032206; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:19:03 -0600 Received: from localhost (adam@localhost) by hive.cec.wustl.edu (8.13.1/8.13.1/Submit) with ESMTP id l04GJ30r032203; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:19:03 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: hive.cec.wustl.edu: adam owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:19:03 -0600 (CST) From: "Adam D. Lopresto" To: Lojban List Subject: [lojban] Re: Regular vs dictionary lujvo In-Reply-To: <3ccac5f10701040724r44dfae9u9480f7dba69c9cb4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <3ccac5f10701040724r44dfae9u9480f7dba69c9cb4@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Score-Int: -25 X-Spam-Bar: -- X-archive-position: 13481 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: adam@pubcrawler.org Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list There is a very long (but informative) paper on this at http://www.lojban.org/files/papers/lujvopap.3 It details the gasnu-based pattern, in particular. On Thu, 4 Jan 2007, Cyril Slobin wrote: > coi rodo > > We all know that: > 1) Tanru have many possible meanings and you must guess the right one > from context. > 2) Lujvo have one meaning and you must to look up it from dictionary. > > But in reality we have a class of a "regular" lujvo which meaning > anyone can guess. I will not bother to dig into the dictionary for a > lujvo starting with sel- or tol- or ending with -mau or -gau. And if a > dictionary will give a different meaning than I have guessed, I will > conclude that this dictionary is Bad, Wrong and Evil. > > But there is a trap. Consider a lujvo "pofygau". Almost anyone will > understand it as "to break (agentive)", and this meaning is listed in > gimste. But someone in lojban_ru community noted that other possible > meaning is "to be a broken agent", "to be unable to cause something". > I believe that most of the sane lojbanists will prefer the first > meaning over the second. Why? Because the "something+gau" pattern is > much more recognizable than "pof+something". "-gau" is more affixish > than "pof-". > > So, I conclude, it will be a Good Thing to have a list of common lujvo > patterns that need not be listed in dictionary, and to have a rule to > resolve conflicts when a given lujvo match two or more patterns. > > For the second goal I suggest the following two rules: > 1) Rafsi derived from cmavo is more affixish (has a higher priority) > than rafsi derived from gismu. > 2) Unless the first rule gives an answer, rafsi at the end of lujvo is > more affixish (has a higher priority) than rafsi at te beginning of > lujvo. > > Any comments? > > ... Once upon a time, in a galaxy far, far away ... > > -- Adam Lopresto http://cec.wustl.edu/~adam/ You see things and say 'Why?'; but I dream things that never were and I say 'Why not?' --George Bernard Shaw To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.