From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sat Jun 30 07:36:12 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sat, 30 Jun 2007 07:36:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1I4e3H-0006cz-R7 for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Sat, 30 Jun 2007 07:35:56 -0700 Received: from an-out-0708.google.com ([209.85.132.246]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1I4e3D-0006cm-4B for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sat, 30 Jun 2007 07:35:55 -0700 Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id b21so296026ana for ; Sat, 30 Jun 2007 07:35:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=LEEaySSMes/E+KrwoVq2drkowd71qE1h1sMsliZKfsMFmCY8q7IZjCcDQa4wNg+4G2lP/uHL1lm+nCo/MEhlRN9aJX+SZglyE9WrmVtJKrlOIISCrusvh1L3HmufnPc5E/iJIag365bO6j9b/9SAeiTbkgQ7DR6JAX0AWmVL6+I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=doXX9y65sVnZC9uISzjV2sQI6t+el2WpzAThkyO15CpkfEyXwgUF357yRAUWJblz3KAAq9GPMmMfLUWc+5cFxCPY6rdDmgvAwankH69Q2c1sEPKrfPmzmNb5zMRkwVrp978VixOr7rShsow5AIVUXtx5CP+tiENM0+MoeDCcHlI= Received: by 10.100.9.19 with SMTP id 19mr2735699ani.1183214147553; Sat, 30 Jun 2007 07:35:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.42.17 with HTTP; Sat, 30 Jun 2007 07:35:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <925d17560706300735g7fefb83bn73fd08b74ea39cf7@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2007 11:35:47 -0300 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: names of the months In-Reply-To: <702226df0706292139p666c4d2bn7fd5fbd12e4e805e@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <200706292003.14636.phma@phma.optus.nu> <01ca01c7babc$cce00580$0302a8c0@TOP> <200706292257.15939.phma@phma.optus.nu> <702226df0706292139p666c4d2bn7fd5fbd12e4e805e@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 13764 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list On 6/30/07, Jon Top Hat Jones wrote: > On 6/29/07, Pierre Abbat wrote: > > On Friday 29 June 2007 22:17, Nathaniel Krause wrote: > > > Why not just cmevla, like we do for the hours? > > > > Huh?? The hours are numbers. You say {ti'u} to indicate that it's a time. You could say the same about {de'i} and months, although months are more like minutes than like hours, as they go in the middle. {de'i li pi'e xa pi'e} would be "In June" without specifying day or year. > > The names of the months have a place structure "x1 is the January/etc. of > year > > x2", so they have to be brivla. So you can say {jbena fi le pamumoi be > > le .ianvari be le 2001moi}. You could also say {jbena fi le 15moi be le 1moi be le 2001moi}. But I agree that having a break from numbers can be nice. > I think I prefer using number form for month, so January would be {pavma'i} > = "x1 is the first month of the year x2", Febuary = {relma'i}, March = > {cibma'i}, etc. One issue with those is that the most direct interpretaion of them gives "month", "bimester", "trimester", ..., "semester", because of the place structure of {masti}. > Also, are there suggested/official lujvo/gismu for the days of the month? If > not, I propose the following: Since {pavdei} is "Monday" and etc., use > {pavdje}, etc. or possibly {pavmoidei}/{pavmoidje} (though I don't much > like the length of the latter two...) for the days of the month, with the > meaning "x1 is the Nth day of the month x2 of the year x3" The official rules are that choice of rafsi should not affect the meaning of a lujvo, so at least in principle {pavdei}, {pavdje} and {pavdjedi} should all have the same meaning. The same problem of months applies in the case of days, the most direct interpretation of {zeldei}, based on place structure, is "week". There are no common words in English for "two-day period", "three-day period" and so on, but that's what place structure suggests. Another issue with them might be the confusion that such names could cause to people such as Portuguese speakers whose native language calls "Monday" the second day, and so on. I don't know how bad that problem would be for them. I actually like the Japanese and Korean system: soldei Sun's day lurdei Moon's day fagdei day of the planet of fire (Mars) jaurdei day of the planet of water (Mercury) mudydei day of the planet of wood (Jupiter) jimdei day of the planet of metal (Venus) derdei day of the planet of earth (Saturn) (Note that Saturday is associated with Saturn, the planet of earth, not with planet Earth.) mu'o mi'e xorxes To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.