From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sat Nov 10 15:37:03 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:37:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Iqzsr-0006fb-UT for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:37:03 -0800 Received: from rv-out-0910.google.com ([209.85.198.190]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Iqzsp-0006fO-U8 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:37:01 -0800 Received: by rv-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b22so733187rvf for ; Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:36:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; bh=ZYfWcRn+34DDcnALBeMbEP34/OtPPhwGQ2lfY87v7l0=; b=WpKU4Q+WNw18JfVofsqs+DvXlHsqi8ICgPL0nujLK0iLxaZvnfC65lH1kvXNPWHuxq7/P6CFLY/wug+6TaQLUw0w1Bu4dcz9i6tWxMpiiDNTDkCo525q/NHLGO7bGV9fZStOy+ZeIjPIkKoQ8ZTC1C+/GZzdzut+ypBiOEZzfqM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; b=iCfj8kI8eSryqaAHz+CiSV6V+KmVYmWRk5rpHL5PII5wUIOnuJz4HMjYoaKlSKo6fG8L9Gf8bS5S6hs7c4ESVRegNt80cKfw3QvqIG2PnJXkrqzrjlDIKLFxL+eH4pPuzm6Gornlqc00k5nSxfxaTovUdqgYcNgFNe7NquoLu6s= Received: by 10.142.142.16 with SMTP id p16mr461994wfd.1194737817241; Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:36:57 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.153.4 with HTTP; Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:36:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <12d58c160711101536r7d5794fdq544c3c5c589c85cd@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 18:36:56 -0500 From: "komfo,amonan" To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: Deutschland In-Reply-To: <02a501c823ef$cf44af00$0202a8c0@TOP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_27707_17687160.1194737816962" References: <200711092247.41574.phma@phma.optus.nu> <02a501c823ef$cf44af00$0202a8c0@TOP> X-Google-Sender-Auth: 77600ae2ff2efb60 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 13914 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: komfoamonan@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list ------=_Part_27707_17687160.1194737816962 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Pierre Abbat" > To: > Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 9:47 PM > Subject: [lojban] Deutschland > > > > The cmene can't be {doitclant} because of the doi/la/lai/la'i rule. The > > Book, > > IIRR, says it's {daitclant}. But the gismu is {dotco}, so why isn't the > > cmene > > {dotclant}? > Consider that both forms derive from the original 'deutsch/Deutschland', & each follows its own morphological rules. Hence 'dotco' is the closest possible word to 'deutsch' in (cultural-) gismu-space, while 'daitclant' is the closest possible word to 'Deutschland' in cmevla-space. On Nov 10, 2007 6:17 PM, Nathaniel Krause wrote: > I'm not sure why one would use a cmevla at all, since there happens to be > a > lujvo, dotygu'e, available with the same meaning. Some folks, myself included, are uncomfortable with the cultural gismu -- they seem to elevate a couple dozen cultures above all the others. (And yes I know I use them, but within a year or so I'll probably dispense with their use entirely.) mu'o mi'e komfn ------=_Part_27707_17687160.1194737816962 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pierre Abbat" < phma@phma.optus.nu>
To: <lojban-list@lojban.org>
Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 9:47 PM
Subject: [lojban] Deutschland


> The cmene can't be {doitclant} because of the doi/la/lai/la'i rule. The
> Book,
> IIRR, says it's {daitclant}. But the gismu is {dotco}, so why isn't the
> cmene
> {dotclant}?

Consider that both forms derive from the original 'deutsch/Deutschland', & each follows its own morphological rules. Hence 'dotco' is the closest possible word to 'deutsch' in (cultural-) gismu-space, while 'daitclant' is the closest possible word to 'Deutschland' in cmevla-space.

On Nov 10, 2007 6:17 PM, Nathaniel Krause <sen@lojbo.org > wrote:
I'm not sure why one would use a cmevla at all, since there happens to be a
lujvo, dotygu'e, available with the same meaning.

Some folks, myself included, are uncomfortable with the cultural gismu -- they seem to elevate  a couple dozen cultures above all the others. (And yes I know I use them, but within a year or so I'll probably dispense with their use entirely.)

mu'o mi'e komfn
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