From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Wed Aug 26 12:23:51 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MgO62-0002Oy-SQ for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:51 -0700 Received: from mail-vw0-f193.google.com ([209.85.212.193]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MgO5z-0002OO-Em for lojban-list@lojban.org; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:50 -0700 Received: by vws31 with SMTP id 31so368135vws.28 for ; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=wjQW9f9L9i4LGuxPdGx6Rwg5SeqgUAiZ7o++OSXnhaM=; b=pkGu0YSPZQgVpN+HccG6erlv20yweD//HFpYYwoq8xscsxh8fORxLHUvBe/elhVI3S mGT4q4daIrVhFql8o+5qGmKq7Lsqe96TTgvfND03yc/0VqnCTJwWwgeE40oVxehx3x6v Iw0KhRN1bnlWb5ItNkC+TR60i9b3O/1kp+WNg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=O0dT5JIq8mUFAu2N2KhpMc5O1ZXq2On+VChN9+H4Nl/QR4VVQbxjsPD8BEFa+tHVOB JltNTiWjpzrr+oFjZynByDJud62CWdRPmkVxOeCfVh2qBQ296EIrRjoICBiZaLEHaAmq 2loCjmqMFmDuRwdS4gkMgPY1PflzeDDVt3kdY= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.18.17 with SMTP id u17mr11108426vca.26.1251314620748; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:40 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <3327.79.75.3.133.1251314231.squirrel@mailgate.denbridgemarine.com> References: <605395.64703.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <3327.79.75.3.133.1251314231.squirrel@mailgate.denbridgemarine.com> Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2009 15:23:40 -0400 Message-ID: <5715b9300908261223w339872e7w52effe27e6d4f117@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban] Re: Compound vs Coordinate Bilinguals From: Luke Bergen To: lojban-list@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00163646d51c78d60b0472106328 X-archive-position: 16048 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --00163646d51c78d60b0472106328 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit so, would a person who grows up bi-lingual (say someone who lives somewhere in Europe where everyone just knows and speaks multiple languages) would this person be "compound bi-lingual" or "coordinate bi-lingual"? On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 3:17 PM, Colin Wright < colin.wright@denbridgemarine.com> wrote: > Sorry, I don't have the original email(s) on this computer. > I'm replying from memory. > > Someone asked about the difference between coordinate and > compound bilingualism. There are several references on the > web found by Google, but this has a clear statement: > > http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/~haroldfs/540/bilingtl/bilingtl.html > > I am not an expert, and I haven't had time to get myself back > up even to the poor standard I once claimed. However ... > > Most would accept that words in one's native langauge often > carry additional "baggage" beyond the stated definitions. > What, exactly are the differences between a pamphlet, booklet, > leaflet, or handout? Each will be defined slightly differently > by different people, and for similar terms in another language > there may be no clean and clear matches. Others here will no > doubt be able to provide better examples, but haven't we all > heard non-native speakers use a word that is superficially > right, but not the word a native speaker would choose? > > My understanding is that coordinate bilinguals will not even > try to find matches, they will simply use the correct word > according to the context. Compound bilinguals, on the other > hand, will tend to carry the same baggage in each language, > and have a much tighter match in semantic mappings. > > The thesis to which I referred found that there was no real > measurable shift in personality for compound bilinguals, but > a clear shift for coordinate bilinguals, which I think is > what I would have predicted if the SWH is true. > > > I look forward to further discussion, ideas, opinions and > clarifications. > > > -- > Denbridge Marine Limited may monitor email traffic data and the > content of email for the purposes of security and staff training. > > Denbridge Marine Limited. > Registered in England and Wales at DSG, 43 Castle St, Liverpool. L2 9TL. > Registered Number 4850477 > > > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org > with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if > you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help. > > --00163646d51c78d60b0472106328 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable so, would a person who grows up bi-lingual (say someone who lives somewhere= in Europe where everyone just knows and speaks multiple languages) would t= his person be "compound bi-lingual" or "coordinate bi-lingua= l"?

On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 3:17 PM, Colin Wrigh= t <colin.wright@denbridgemarine.com> wrote:
Sorry, I don't have the original email(s) on this computer.
I'm replying from memory.

Someone asked about the difference between coordinate and
compound bilingualism. =A0There are several references on the
web found by Google, but this has a clear statement:

=A0http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/~haroldfs/540/bilingtl/bi= lingtl.html

I am not an expert, and I haven't had time to get myself back
up even to the poor standard I once claimed. =A0However ...

Most would accept that words in one's native langauge often
carry additional "baggage" beyond the stated definitions.
What, exactly are the differences between a pamphlet, booklet,
leaflet, or handout? Each will be defined slightly differently
by different people, and for similar terms in another language
there may be no clean and clear matches. =A0Others here will no
doubt be able to provide better examples, but haven't we all
heard non-native speakers use a word that is superficially
right, but not the word a native speaker would choose?

My understanding is that coordinate bilinguals will not even
try to find matches, they will simply use the correct word
according to the context. =A0Compound bilinguals, on the other
hand, will tend to carry the same baggage in each language,
and have a much tighter match in semantic mappings.

The thesis to which I referred found that there was no real
measurable shift in personality for compound bilinguals, but
a clear shift for coordinate bilinguals, which I think is
what I would have predicted if the SWH is true.


I look forward to further discussion, ideas, opinions and
clarifications.


--
Denbridge Marine Limited may monitor email traffic data and the
content of email for the purposes of security and staff training.

Denbridge Marine Limited.
Registered in England and Wales at DSG, 43 Castle St, Liverpool. L2 9TL. Registered Number 4850477


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