From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Sep 08 02:22:00 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:22:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mkwtk-0004iB-0V for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:22:00 -0700 Received: from mail-ew0-f216.google.com ([209.85.219.216]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mkwte-0004Ft-4F for lojban-list@lojban.org; Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:21:59 -0700 Received: by ewy12 with SMTP id 12so3550655ewy.0 for ; Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:21:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=vMJFBI2PNn1gyZAE7hwKTseNMC1xvCt7EhOAYGjLf5Q=; b=AJQA9NmPj13eyvfl4iy7I9w1ugrG6IWIcm5YzyEdgzksKhUzszSIeUcqmpCtNdL9zk 18HcY8t1rbE23jDvgvWLWsb5D0vBq+6+kSPqEblXgzi5FmbT8Dh8/8xWKGPbMJ4FaI6I 6c7zP2wzrpY8U+/IvK5Hn6nT1y48WkA/mimck= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=ZJ1jtNNsevoV9hI0D1v4lNrXxyR2NnF4tK139TcKCu76qcXcIxJzjf4x6Sv1OZiRBj z88jEx+PF3ZDHngvjghD2837nLN/T21fIBFAfMnQGeZ9esp+BvueNg1FU7WvjW/Ury/w Do6zNkJCuzxPc25rYXJFhdUaNNmU8H7u05dEU= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.211.159.15 with SMTP id l15mr17410918ebo.96.1252401707806; Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:21:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <9ada8ecd0909051425t78a046f3kddef2869e5c8e7a2@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560909060746n223ad9c7ic88894c3513a6ea1@mail.gmail.com> <9ada8ecd0909061401n35c37197j6ff4fac5b267fc5e@mail.gmail.com> <9ada8ecd0909061426r95b84efu76464f7327430f6c@mail.gmail.com> <395902.46727.qm@web50406.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <9ada8ecd0909061448p2eaa92ep19569f2b66793b76@mail.gmail.com> <386480.83513.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <9ada8ecd0909071709s5181e5d4r8e7803ac95581ad3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 12:21:47 +0300 Message-ID: <9ada8ecd0909080221h297baa5eqb5eba2ad6ac1d5d5@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban] Re: xorlo From: Squark Rabinovich To: lojban-list@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636d34484e8ef4d04730d7e60 X-archive-position: 16105 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: top.squark@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --001636d34484e8ef4d04730d7e60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Let's try to translate the sentence "Do you hear a woman/girl talking?" You are suggesting *xu do tirna lo nu da poi nanmu cu tavla* **Is this the only way to say that in xorlo? In pre-xorlo, that would be *xu do tirna lo nu lo nanmu cu tavla* * * Also, what happens when we run out of *da de di* (that is, 3 variables aren't enough) ? Hmm, even worse, what's *lo nu ? "*The event?" I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be "an event", see http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=How%20to%20use%20xorlo So it appears to be *lo* is unspecific whereas *le* is specific after all... On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 3:24 AM, Arran wrote: > Personally I think you are using le/la/lo too much if this is your > problem.. Past beginner level I think that the need for le/la/lo should wear > off, as you start using things like da/de/PA, ect > > > On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:09 AM, Squark Rabinovich wrote: > >> Also *lo* is as specific as *le* but veridicial? How is it possible, >> then, to refer to unspecific objects? Suppose I want to say "there exists a >> *broda* such that..." or "all *broda* have the property..." >> > > --001636d34484e8ef4d04730d7e60 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Let's try to translate the sentence "Do you hear = a woman/girl talking?" You are suggesting

xu do = tirna lo nu da poi nanmu cu tavla

Is th= is the only way to say that in xorlo? In pre-xorlo, that would be

xu do tirna lo nu lo nanmu cu tavla

Also, what happens when we run out of da de di= =A0(that is, 3 variables aren't enough) ?

Hmm,= even worse, what's lo nu ? "The event?" I'm prett= y sure it's supposed to be "an event", see=A0http://= www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=3DHow%20to%20use%20xorlo=A0So i= t appears to be lo=A0is unspecific whereas le=A0is specific a= fter all...

On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 3:24 AM, Ar= ran <arran4@gmail.= com> wrote:
Personally I think you are using le/la/lo too much if this is your problem.= . Past beginner level I think that the need for le/la/lo should wear off, a= s you start using things like da/de/PA, ect


On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 10:09 AM, Squark Rabinovich <top.squark@gmail.co= m> wrote:
Also lo=A0is as specific as le=A0but veridicial? How is= it possible, then, to refer to unspecific objects? Suppose I want to say &= quot;there exists a broda=A0such that..." or "all broda= =A0have the property..."


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