From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Sep 15 10:07:34 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:07:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MnbV8-0007Mr-7v for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:07:34 -0700 Received: from mail-yw0-f204.google.com ([209.85.211.204]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MnbV3-0007MS-9P for lojban-list@lojban.org; Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:07:34 -0700 Received: by ywh42 with SMTP id 42so2515375ywh.30 for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:07:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=dHhhtlUAjv3aHPDD7QoiUB+iMs09xGIbpZY9ufbnKtg=; b=EyKsdwUIUNfqeCExup8j472nUKlehYjt0nn5SUS294IOqAcDmulVfmPALqBFB9d8Dh FSH4UoKgY7sTFWxn8Y1UPwRs9KVBv0OLDQ3SxxvdQ2pyx6Vb1JAzQciZeIZJzljxve1+ cexhCPAT42a+ZDKhrgq3271t9owwVqdag2paQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=Mf1cyzf8Lufk7LVq1j0PupG8oEKFBTaPEOx06N4IaeDWmzK/qSlth20LhXlDD34fy4 FtrK90K2TtlNat62h90ilFOaUzH6Vnm78ehyLR/8oBeSnN1jrwAtoVzsk+BQus3N0dty uzym7+ehbaz7lZQTyGaQG+OTxRlc6lNoP8sH8= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.150.240.15 with SMTP id n15mr12835570ybh.212.1253034442294; Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:07:22 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 13:07:22 -0400 Message-ID: <5715b9300909151007t7323c1ebw83e467ab6afc2d29@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban] Re: Fwd: lojban and raising a child bi-lingual From: Luke Bergen To: lojban-list@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd2c1e0d3051b0473a0d0a0 X-archive-position: 16184 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --000e0cd2c1e0d3051b0473a0d0a0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm wondering if it has less to do with how quickly children learn a language and more to do with how effortless that learning is. I don't see 1.5 year olds sitting in a classroom learning about prepositions, they just get it by being around people using them. Although some people argue that adults can do that too if they're completel= y immersed in a culture that speaks the target language. On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 12:05 PM, wrote: > In a message dated 9/14/2009 22:56:36 Eastern Daylight Time, > phma@phma.optus.nu writes: > > > "One reason that small children are slower at learning languages than > teenagers and adults is that they still haven=92t learned to segment the > world > yet. They have to learn which person is mama and which is dada; where the > arm > ends and the hand begins; what shade is blue, what shade is green and wha= t > is > in between; and thousands of other things. This is a huge task that peopl= e > don=92t have to repeat when learning a second language after they=92re a = bit > older." - > http://czechmatediary.com/2009/01/15/even-experts-dont-know-how-children-= learn-languages/ > > > > This is contrary to everything I've heard or read about children learning > their first language. Second languages are a different matter, perhaps. > > Children manage in the first few years of life to learn a language fluent= ly > from scratch. No other age group can claim that. > > stevo --000e0cd2c1e0d3051b0473a0d0a0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm wondering if it has less to do with how quickly children learn a la= nguage and more to do with how effortless that learning is.

I don= 9;t see 1.5 year olds sitting in a classroom learning about prepositions, t= hey just get it by being around people using them.

Although some people argue that adults can do that too if they're c= ompletely immersed in a culture that speaks the target language.

On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 12:05 PM, <MorphemeAddict@wmconn= ect.com> wrote:
In a message dated 9/14/20= 09 22:56:36 Eastern Daylight Time, phma@phma.optus.nu writes:


"One reaso= n that small children are slower at learning languages than
teenagers a= nd adults is that they still haven=92t learned to segment the world
yet. They have to learn which person is mama and which is dada; where the a= rm
ends and the hand begins; what shade is blue, what shade is green an= d what is
in between; and thousands of other things. This is a huge tas= k that people
don=92t have to repeat when learning a second language after they=92re a bi= t
older." -http://cze= chmatediary.com/2009/01/15/even-experts-dont-know-how-children-learn-langua= ges/

This is contrary to everything I've heard or read about children le= arning their first language. =A0Second languages are a different matter, pe= rhaps.

Children manage in the first few years of life to learn a language flue= ntly from scratch. =A0No other age group can claim that.

stevo

--000e0cd2c1e0d3051b0473a0d0a0-- To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.