From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Dec 18 06:03:29 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Fri, 18 Dec 2009 06:03:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NLdQX-0002pK-5H for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Fri, 18 Dec 2009 06:03:29 -0800 Received: from mail-yw0-f187.google.com ([209.85.211.187]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NLdOD-0001yT-54 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Fri, 18 Dec 2009 06:01:10 -0800 Received: by ywh17 with SMTP id 17so3753411ywh.2 for ; Fri, 18 Dec 2009 06:00:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=Mg1wL/j1YTC1vKtb6EKiWfPJ6DwmevyS6olWJWp1//c=; b=rOflmOjp0t3JQu8aSvF/+UGKrrrg8IznTxnPpOMZxpQ9OsO9SWtqOtjeE63oGlc0T4 tyYzdxM8A60ZETW5Vj9oMcpFbpjEaWePw4X2f8L9EbCljiIsgZ7MGMEp0TxAxresj4ji Weq8+BCKfDMF54oq1GfoUFojHNoWhF4xn3FIM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=j9dMnGoUUZZl3KJJ+co700mmaXGA8iGFYet+Up9mNlzlB0qfp+8qCLbMshfYKj042H vvTRG3RK5KVYyUwA45jBNkNz3WNVfhGnZrbZH6wt2KZrchjADhAyo6mY8+ezEFhbLRWW AdslaS2uW/HHTiHLCb6Zq/LHorTGmn9w0wwv4= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.150.129.13 with SMTP id b13mr6111389ybd.314.1261144858589; Fri, 18 Dec 2009 06:00:58 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <5715b9300912171323y6c5a659dy22db9f86144402be@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Dec 2009 09:00:58 -0500 Message-ID: <5715b9300912180600h37d7d855v60f915f1cd2dae2c@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban] Re: tense question From: Luke Bergen To: lojban-list@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd5a2a64e7b26047b012bbc X-archive-position: 16687 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --000e0cd5a2a64e7b26047b012bbc Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 .ua ki'e On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:52 AM, Daniel Brockman wrote: > On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 10:23 PM, Luke Bergen > wrote: > > So I've been trying to learn the tense words and it occurred to me that I > > don't really understand the difference between {ca} and {ca'o}. I kind > of > > understand the difference between {ba} and {ba'o} I guess, but when {ca} > is > > used like: {mi nelci do ba lo nu do nelci mi} how is it different from > > {ca'o}? > > I guess you mean {mi nelci do ca lo nu do nelci mi}. > > Short answer: {ca} = "when", {ca'o} = "while". The difference is that > {ca} is about points in time, whereas {ca'o} is about periods in time. > > While {broda ca ko'a} means that broda and ko'a overlap at some point > in time, {broda ca'o ko'a} means that broda occurs during ko'a. This > means that {ca} is symmetrical while {ca'o} is not: {broda ca lo nu > brode} = {brode ca lo nu broda}, pretty much, but {broda ca'o lo nu > brode} is not the same as {brode ca'o lo nu broda}. > > .i mi nelci do ca lo nu do nelci mi > I like you when you like me. > I like you at some instant when you like me. > > .i mi nelci do ca'o lo nu do nelci mi > I like you while you like me. > I like you the whole time you like me. > > Since {ca} is more general than {ca'o}, you can safely use {ca} when > in doubt and you can pretty much never go wrong. When you use {ca'o}, > you're kind of emphasizing that something occurs during a whole > period. When you use {ca}, you're not emphasising anything in > particular, just anchoring the event to a point in time. > > -- > Daniel Brockman > daniel@brockman.se > > > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org > with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if > you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help. > > --000e0cd5a2a64e7b26047b012bbc Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable .ua ki'e

On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 6:52= AM, Daniel Brockman <daniel@brockman.se> wrote:
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 10:23 PM, Luke Be= rgen <lukeabergen@gmail.com= > wrote:
> So I've been trying to learn the tense words and it occurred to me= that I
> don't really understand the difference between {ca} and {ca'o}= . =A0I kind of
> understand the difference between {ba} and {ba'o} I guess, but whe= n {ca} is
> used like: {mi nelci do ba lo nu do nelci mi} how is it different from=
> {ca'o}?

I guess you mean {mi nelci do ca lo nu do nelci mi}.

Short answer: {ca} =3D "when", {ca'o} =3D "while". = =A0The difference is that
{ca} is about points in time, whereas {ca'o} is about periods in time.<= br>
While {broda ca ko'a} means that broda and ko'a overlap at some poi= nt
in time, {broda ca'o ko'a} means that broda occurs during ko'a.= =A0This
means that {ca} is symmetrical while {ca'o} is not: {broda ca lo nu
brode} =3D {brode ca lo nu broda}, pretty much, but {broda ca'o lo nu brode} is not the same as {brode ca'o lo nu broda}.

.i mi nelci do ca lo nu do nelci mi
I like you when you like me.
I like you at some instant when you like me.

.i mi nelci do ca'o lo nu do nelci mi
I like you while you like me.
I like you the whole time you like me.

Since {ca} is more general than {ca'o}, you can safely use {ca} when in doubt and you can pretty much never go wrong. =A0When you use {ca'o}= ,
you're kind of emphasizing that something occurs during a whole
period. =A0When you use {ca}, you're not emphasising anything in
particular, just anchoring the event to a point in time.

--
Daniel Brockman
daniel@brockman.se


To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org
with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if
you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.


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