From cbmvax!uunet!ai.mit.edu!grackle!bob Wed Jun 12 09:31:37 1991 Return-Path: id AA02244; Tue, 11 Jun 91 16:15:31 EDT Date: Tue, 11 Jun 91 16:15:31 EDT Message-Id: <9106112015.AA02244@grackle.UUCP> To: cbmvax!snark.thyrsus.com!lojbab Cc: ai-lab!lojban-list@snark.thyrsus.com, bob@ai.mit.edu In-Reply-To: Bob LeChevalier's message of Tue, 11 Jun 91 02:43 EDT Subject: expanding BAI form Reply-To: cbmvax!uunet!gnu.ai.mit.edu!grackle!bob From: cbmvax!uunet!gnu.ai.mit.edu!grackle!bob Sender: cbmvax!uunet!gnu.ai.mit.edu!grackle!bob Status: RO In his very interesting message on cleft places and other matters, la lojbab aks whether a member of the BAI lexeme should be an abbreviation for a specific FIhO construct. He says This was not the original intent, ... ...we have drifted from [the] original, rather more metaphorical use of BAI; the current meanings are too closely tied to their associated gismu, and have lost touch with their original purpose. This drift certainly is a simplification. Perhaps we should formalize it. A while back, John Cowan's clarified for me how the members of GOI work (other than GOI itself) by using an explanation in which the construct is expanded into a longer relative clause. Here is what John said: Each of the members of GOI (other than GOI itself, which is used for anaphora assignment and isn't closely related) can be expanded into a relative clause with poi/noi, thus: pe -> poi srana (which is relevant to) ne -> noi srana (which, incidentally, is relevant to) po'u -> poi du (which is equal to) no'u -> noi du (which, incidentally, is equal to) po -> poi steci (which is specific to) po'e -> poi se ponse (which is possessed by) As soon as I read this, I could remember pe, ne and the rest and understood how to use them. Perhaps we can do the same for members of selma'o BAI. Each of the members of BAI can be expanded into a form with fi'o and the member's associated gismu; each of these expansions can, in turn, be expanded into a relative clause with poi: ka'a zo'e -> fi'o klama zo'e -> poi zo'e klama For example: le zarci ka'a mi cu barda le zarci fi'o klama mi cu barda the market gone to by me is big. le zarci poi mi klama [ke'a] cu barda the market which I go to [it] is big. klama kla come come/go to...from...via...using... Here is another example, that starts out with the situation that: mi pilno le kabri lo mruli I use the cup as a hammer. The result is: le kabri pi'o mi cu porpi le kabri fi'o pilno mi cu porpi the cup used by me is broken. le kabri poi mi pilno [ke'a] cu porpi The cup which I use [it] is broken. pilno pli use use...for... 'employ' Now, let us consider using the second places for these selma'o: Corresponding with the expansion for the first place, the the second place form could expand like this: seka'a zo'e -> fi'o se klama zo'e -> poi zo'e se klama For example: mi sipna seka'a lo senva mi sipna fi'o se klama lo senva I sleep with destination dreams. or more clearly: mi seka'a lo senva cu sipna mi fi'o se klama lo senva cu sipna I with destination dreams sleep. mi poi lo senva se klama cu sipna I who dreams are gone to sleep. The second place of pilno is `that-which-is-used-as-tool': mi sepi'o le kabri cu marxa le spisa be lo sakta mi fi'o se pilno le kabri cu marxa le spisa be lo sakta I using-as-tool the cup crush the lump of sugar. mi poi le kabri se pilno [ke'a] cu marxa le spisa be lo sakta I who the cup is used by [me] crush the lump of sugar. It appears to me that one could apply this expansion to all the members of BAI selma'o, except that, as la lojbab says: However, some of the meanings of the BAI members, especially SE-converted ones from the 'main use' we had in mind when we selected the word, may change. I have found some of the troublesome ones; here they are, marked with [??]: (My suggested redefintions are not intended to be more than hints.) ki'u because of reason (justified by) seki'u reason therefore (with reason) [??] [perhaps redefine as what-reason-is-for] seki'unai reason nevertheless (despite reason) ki'unai despite reason krinu rin ki'u reason reason/justification for...(obj./event) ma'i in reference frame (by standard 2; cf ja'i) sema'i as a standard for (of reference) [??] [perhaps redefine as what-is-observed] manri mar reference reference frame for observing..w/rules.. mau exceeded by (a greater) semau more than (relative!) [??] semaunai not more than (relative!) [??] zmadu zad zma mau more exceeds...in property...by amount... me'a undercut by (a lesser) seme'a less than (relative!) [??] [perhaps redefine as what-is-greater] seme'anai not less than (relative!) [??] [perhaps redefine as not-what-is-greater] mleca lesser ...is less than ... [a mekso bridi] mu'i because of motive semu'i motive therefore [??] [perhaps redefine as purposeful-doer] semu'inai motive nevertheless mu'inai despite motive mukti muk mu'i purpose purpose/goal for...(obj./event) 'motive' ni'i logically because (entailment) seni'i entails therefore seni'inai entails nevertheless (denied entail) [??] ni'inai despite logic (denied entail) nibli nib ni'i necessitate necessitate/entail/imply...for rules... ri'a causal because (phys./mental) ri'anai despite cause (phys./mental) seri'a causal therefore (phys./mental) [??] [perhaps redefine as causal-result] seri'anai causal nevertheless (phys./mental) rinka rik ri'a cause cause for...under... I typed in all the members of BAI lexeme along with their associated gismu and will post the list in a second message so you can make the comparisons yourself. Robert J. Chassell bob@gnu.ai.mit.edu Rattlesnake Mountain Road (413) 298-4725 or (617) 253-8568 or Stockbridge, MA 01262-0693 USA (617) 876-3296 (for messages)