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To: lojban-list@snark.thyrsus.com
Subject: Re: expanding BAI form 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 11 Jun 91 16:15:31 EDT."
             <9106112015.AA02244@grackle.UUCP> 
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 91 08:51:54 +0100
Status: RO
X-From-Space-Date: Thu Jun 13 12:56:33 1991
X-From-Space-Address: cbmvax!uunet!math.ucla.edu!jimc

Bob Chassell writes:
> John [Cowan] said:
> 
>     Each of the members of GOI (other than GOI itself, which is used for
>     anaphora assignment and isn't closely related) can be expanded into a
>     relative clause with poi/noi, thus ...
> 
> As soon as I read this, I could remember pe, ne and the rest and
> understood how to use them.
> 
> Perhaps we can do the same for members of selma'o BAI.

Hear, hear for the pan-predicatist position!  
(a) Pan-predicate definitions are easier for the users to learn.  
(b) Similarly for mechanicals, i.e. it's easier for computer programs
	to handle pan-predicates than non-predicate special cases.
(c) Theory is easier in that there's only one deep structure you have
	to theorize about.
(d) A "predicate language" OUGHT to be filled with predicates.

Disadvantages of pan-predicatism:
(a) It's "traditional" for certain structures (especially <UI>) to not
	be predicates.
(b) It's "traditional" for predicates to be all tied up with "claims",
	"veridical statements", etc, which are inappropriate for some
	usages, especially <UI>.  As a parallel, consider the s-bridi of
	a sumti, which is obviously a predicate relation but which makes 
	no claim.
(c) Without question, users will rebel if required to say everything as
	a bridi with explicit words.  The pan-predicate interpretations
	can only be deep structures, to which non-bridi surface structures
	(such as diklujvo, <BAI> and <UI>) are transformed.  
(d) If you have predicates you must have arguments for them, requiring 
	extensive and precise transformation rules to import those 
	arguments from main level.  Such rules have not been contemplated
	before in the tanru-based Loglan / Lojban.  Send for your FREE
	demo disc today!  Enclose 0.75 pengo for shipping and handling,
	to The -gua!spi Institute...

		-- jimc