From cbmvax!uunet!CUVMA.BITNET!LOJBAN Fri Jan 31 09:54:59 1992 Return-Path: Received: by snark.thyrsus.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.21.1 #21.19) id ; Fri, 31 Jan 92 09:54 EST Received: by cbmvax.cbm.commodore.com (5.57/UUCP-Project/Commodore 2/8/91) id AA04706; Fri, 31 Jan 92 09:31:21 EST Received: from cunixf.cc.columbia.edu by relay1.UU.NET with SMTP (5.61/UUNET-internet-primary) id AA03795; Fri, 31 Jan 92 09:17:47 -0500 Received: from cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu by cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (5.59/FCB) id AA10516; Fri, 31 Jan 92 09:17:49 EST Message-Id: <9201311417.AA10516@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> Received: from CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.1) with BSMTP id 3299; Fri, 31 Jan 92 09:15:15 EST Received: by CUVMB (Mailer R2.07) id 6054; Fri, 31 Jan 92 09:14:53 EST Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1992 09:14:28 EST Reply-To: "Mark E. Shoulson" Sender: Lojban list From: "Mark E. Shoulson" Subject: Wallops #4: Freddy Germanos article no. 2 X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: John Cowan , Eric Raymond , Eric Tiedemann In-Reply-To: nsn%MULLIAN.EE.MU.OZ.AU@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu's message of Sat, 25 Jan 1992 11:31:49 +1100 Status: RO Sorry I took so long to catch this one; as a picker of nits, I feel shame at missing this so long. Nick. Buddy. Come close to the screen. Look close. Watch the sentence, and tell me what's wrong. You wrote: >ni'o mi fonta'a la ringos.star. ca le purlamdei .i ra carmi xalbo .i puzi >citka lo kruji gi'e pu'i bredi lenu se vitke lei pu sonci pe la .elalaMEIN. >zi'enoi djica lenu zanrysku lenu la ringos. virnu What's wrong with this picture? Could it be that ".elalaMEIN." isn't a valid cmene? Probably. Not one, but two illegal syllables, even by the less restrictive, newer rules. Side point: This is actually arguable, since it's reasonable to assert that the word syllablizes into "el-al-am-ein" or some such, thus avoiding the "la" syllable, but I fear such shenanigans aren't recognized by Lojban. I'm not doing this (just) to humiliate Nick in public; he's one of the best we've got. But even he blows this one. If you ask me, the "la/lai/doi" will be one of the first things to go once the baseline is lifted. It's just too damn easy to miss it. I'd be tempted to advocate losing the restriction altogether and universally requiring pauses before, as well as after, cmene, but I think that'd be a pain to pronounce. ~mark (shoulson@ctr.columbia.edu)