From nsn@MULLIAN.EE.MU.OZ.AU Ukn Aug 2 06:45:23 1993 Received: from YALEVM.YCC.YALE.EDU by MINERVA.CIS.YALE.EDU via SMTP; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 06:45:21 -0400 Received: from CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU by YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 9555; Mon, 02 Aug 93 06:43:53 EDT Received: from CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 9363; Mon, 02 Aug 93 05:16:41 EDT Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1993 19:13:51 +1000 Reply-To: Nick Nicholas Sender: Lojban list From: Nick Nicholas Subject: TECH: anniversary X-To: Lojban Mailing List To: Erik Rauch Status: RO X-Status: Message-ID: <96viKEqASYJ.A.9XH.Ty0kLB@chain.digitalkingdom.org> I'm going through new lujvo these days, and have foundered on the concept of anniversary. I'm not happy with And's {kratentei}, and I suggest, for comment: tembavtei: t1(1)=t2(3) t1(2) t1(3) b2 t(2)2. To elucidate: consider the Mahler Centenary Year in 2010, commemorating his death in 1910. With my proposed lujvo, I seem to capture the place structure And desired, namely: x1 is a period of time of type x2 x3 units of time of type x4 after inception of x5 le la maler. nanca la 1pi'e1pi'e2010nan. la 31pi'e12pi'e2010nan. lenu la maler. co'a morsi kei la 1910nan. Mahler year, from 2010/1/1 to 2010/12/31, is the anniversary of Mahler's death in 1910. (thence tembavnanca, tembavdei, etc); detkrefu (from the Esperanto datreveno): k1 k2=d1 d2 k3 le la maler. nanca la ny.pi'e my.pi'e (Date of death) detkrefu lenu la maler. co'a morsi kei li 100 Mahler year, is the 100th anniversary of Mahler's death on x/y (but the detri x/y is unhelpful, and we don't know what there has been a hundred of between the death and 2010, though putting in "le la maler. nanca la nypi'emypi'e 1910nan. cu detkrefu" is better. bavytemkrefu: k1 t1 b2 k3 Much better in place structure, though its semantics is vague: x is the w-th time that there has been a time of duration y after event z. It has to be taken as implicit that these times of duration y are contiguous. le la maler. nanca lo nanca be li pa cu bavytemkrefu lenu la maler. co'a morsi kei li 100 Mahler year is the 100th anniversary of a year of Mahler's death. This coining is the one I'd gravitate to, but it omits And's duration of the anniversary. I think something like bavytemkrefu salcytei will do the trick, given a modification of salci from just celebration towards commemoration (as Lojbab seems to have already implied). In that case, the duration of the anniversary can be part of the place structure of salcytei. Alternatively, the rather messy lujvo: bavytemkrefytei: t1(1)=k1 t1(2) t1(3) t2(1) b2 k3 le la maler. masti la 1pi'e7pi'e2010nan. la 31pi'e7'e2010nan. cu bavytemkrefytei lo nanca lenu la maler. co'a morsi kei li 100 Mahler month, starting 2010-7-1, ending 2010-7-31 is the 100th anniversary of a year of Mahler's death. For more practical contexts, of course, things like: bavytemkrefymasti: m1 t1 b2 k3 m3 are possible: le la maler. masti cu bavytemkrefymasti lo nanca be li pa lenu la maler. co'a morsi kei li 100 Mahler month is the 100th anniversary month of a year of Mahler's death. If we now swallow into the lujvo that troublesome "lo nanca be li pa", we get something long, but with the place structure we'd want: bavyna'arefmasti (after-year-recurring-month: the month of the recurring years after...): m1 b2 k3 m3 le la maler masti cu bavyna'arefmasti lenu la maler. co'a morsi kei li 100 Mahler month is the 100th annual-anniversary of Mahler's death. I think this last lujvo, which is what we usually mean by "anniversary", and its much more general counterpart bavytemkrefu, are the way to go; I'd appreciate comments. Incidentally, the use of krefu to denote anniversaries, or editions (particularly of newspapers/magazines) may indicate it's worth broadening the current definition of "krefu". ******************************************************************************* A freshman once observed to me: Nick Nicholas am I, of Melbourne, Oz. On the edge of the Rubicon, nsn@munagin.ee.mu.oz.au (IRC: nicxjo) men don't go fishing. CogSci and CompSci & wannabe Linguist. - Alice Goodman, _Nixon In China_ Mail me! Mail me! Mail me! Or don't!!